Colonel Mustard in the bathroom with a wrench

by liberal japonicus

Seymour Hersh reporting on who sabotaged the Nord Pipeline, from former frontpager Thomas Nephew's FB.

https://seymourhersh.substack.com/p/how-america-took-out-the-nord-stream

More recently, Victoria Nuland expressed satisfaction at the demise of the newest of the pipelines. Testifying at a Senate Foreign Relations Committee hearing in late January she told Senator Ted Cruz, “​Like you, I am, and I think the Administration is, very gratified to know that Nord Stream 2 is now, as you like to say, a hunk of metal at the bottom of the sea.”

The source had a much more streetwise view of Biden’s decision to sabotage more than 1500 miles of Gazprom pipeline as winter approached. “Well,” he said, speaking of the President, “I gotta admit the guy has a pair of balls. He said he was going to do it, and he did.”

Asked why he thought the Russians failed to respond, he said cynically, “Maybe they want the capability to do the same things the U.S. did.

“It was a beautiful cover story,” he went on. “Behind it was a covert operation that placed experts in the field and equipment that operated on a covert signal.

“The only flaw was the decision to do it.”

 

Reading between the lines here, the source revealed this because he thought that the US shouldn't have done it and Thomas has a similar view. I'm of two minds about this. Looking at the timeline of the invasion, the sabotage of the pipeline occurred on 26 Sept, shortly after the partial mobilisation by Putin on 22 Sept. (link of timeline: warning, some triggering pictures there) The capability to do this was, according to Hersh, was during BALTOPS, which took place in early June. The Hersh article has a clip from a press conference where Biden says that “If Russia invades Ukraine, one way or another Nord Stream 2 will not move forward.”

I'm assuming that Biden told Scholz that the US had the capability to take out the pipeline and would, which would account for Scholz' hard line. And when Putin escalated with the mobilization in Sept, that was the impetus to do this. That's what I see with the timeline, though the Hersh article points out that once the charges are put in place, there is basically no turning back from the decision.

I've got a bunch thoughts about this, listed in alphabetical order.

• Damn, pretty ballsy for an 80 old guy
• Is this something we should have done?
• Is this something we would have been stupid not to do?
• How has all of this factored into Putin's decisions?

Thoughts? Please, no ChatGPT essays.

Comments

[Girl from the North Country]

My thoughts are pretty similar to your thoughts, lj. And on points 2 and 3, with all the ethical, and also practical, implications associated.

Please, no ChatGPT essays.

Amen.

[bobbyp]

I'm coming around to the idea that the Sy Hersh I read back in the day (My Lai) is not the Sy Hersh we see today. Very sad.

[Donald]

I am not coming around to that view, bobbyp, though this story may or may not be true. I came to the view a long time ago that most of the press is largely worthless in the same way that Fox is worthless— if a story doesn’t fit a given narrative, don’t print it.

It is amusing how people have studiously ignored the indications that either the US or some other Western country did this.

I expect truthful accounts of the Ukraine War sometime after I am dead.

[Donald]

My own guess is that one takes the story with caution, but the US is a very likely candidate.

On the press in general, they tend to be herd animals on national security stories, mostly following what the Blob says, emphasizing the stories they say are important. Hersh never cared about anybody’s preferred narrative. ( Tangential rant narrowly averted here.)

[GftNC]

Further to which (not Nord Stream, but the general West v Russia situation regarding Ukraine), this puts a persuasive, if slightly depressing view of how and how much the west should help Ukraine. Depressing because Zelenskiy is inspirational, and his speech to parliament yesterday in the 900 year old Westminster Hall was stirring. I guess maybe one should always beware of the effects of stirring wartime leaders...

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/feb/09/zelenskiy-jets-west-ukraine-battlefield-peace

[wj]

My own guess is that one takes the story with caution, but the US is a very likely candidate.

IF the failure was due to a deliberate act, then certainly the US is one of the countries with the capability to do it. In short, *a* candidate. But hardly the only non-Russian candidate.

And whether we are looking at deliberate sabotogue or not remains unproven.

There is definitely a place in journalism for anonymous sources. But, as Pifer notes in bobbyp's link, this claimed anonymous source would have needed access to a startling breadth of people and/or meetings. Broad enough that anonymity seems improbable, at least as regards anyone else in those meetings. (I think we can safely assume that Biden wasn't the source. Right?)

[bob sykes]

This attack cannot occur without US permission and at least logistical support. So, the US is in it up to its snout.

Second, this was not an attack against Russia, it was an attack against Germany, an attempt to bring Germany to heel. And it worked. Germany is once again properly submissive.

[Nord]

Seymour at his best is a useful idiot, at worst a fellow traveler. My Lai was his high point. It's been all downhill since then.

[wj]

This attack cannot occur without US permission and at least logistical support. So, the US is in it up to its snout.

I was not aware that various European countries are unable to conduct such an attack. Especially right in their own back yard. Could you provide a source for this?

[Hartmut]

I have no doubt that Poland had both the motive and the means but that does not mean that I would accuse them without actual evidence.

[Donald]

"Seymour at his best is a useful idiot, at worst a fellow traveler. My Lai was his high point. It's been all downhill since then."

Classic McCarthyism, followed by absurd summary of Hersh's career.

On the motives of Hersh's source, reliable or not, it could be a large number of things--it could be a left-leaning Ellsberg type, or a rightwinger who dislikes Biden or Blinken or Nuland (you don't have to be rightwing to dislike them, however) or someone who thinks it was a mistake or even someone who thinks it was a good idea but has some obscure bureaucratic reason for disliking what was done or how it was done. I've seen some people speculating about the source's motives and the reasons are endless or anyway fairly long. (And of course they could be good or bad or a mixture.)

[Marc]

The US maintains an extensive network of ocean floor hydrophone arrays and high powered ocean surveillance radar satellites. No ship or submarine moves anywhere without the position being carefully tracked. If it was not an accident (and this is still a big if, although the few released photos don't look like an accident), the US knows who did do it. Since they aren't saying, it is not unreasonable to presume that it was done with at least the tacit permission of the US.

[Hartmut]

The Baltic Sea is a sonar nightmare. I doubt that technology has changed that much, so acting undetected underwater seems far from impossible there especially with decades of experience in developing stealthy subs specifically for this region (e.g. by Germany and Sweden). And that would be full size military subs, not small specialized craft with even less of a signature.

[wj]

Since they aren't saying, it is not unreasonable to presume that it was done with at least the tacit permission of the US.

Knowing, after the fact, who did something**, and choosing to keep quiet about, it is rather different from giving permission ahead of time. Tacitly or explicitly.

** And, as Hartmet points out, whether we know (or even have the capability to know, given the particular environment) is debatable. Especially since, these days, a small drone controlled from the surface could place the charges.

[nous]

I've done a bit of poking, trying to see what people with expertise in these matters have to say, and none of it really adds any certainty to Hersh's very certain account. What I have are mostly questions and some thoughts on other possible scenarios.

I wonder about the anonymous source's motives and timing. Assuming that the source is legit as is the information, how does revealing it at this stage in the ongoing war help lead anything to a resolution? The best that the source can hope to achieve is to damage US relations with Russia and Germany and stir up the RW media to attack Biden. That seems to me like a move that is aimed at adding fuel to the Hunter Biden/Blinken/Ukraine circus coming soon to a town near you via the new House leadership.

Why did Hersh write with such certitude when, by his own account anyway, he's working from the account of a single anonymous source and some research to see if the scenario was possible? Why not take a more circumspect tone, especially knowing the volatility of this information?

(For the record, I have no doubt that the US could have done this, and I think that the US finds the destruction of the pipeline strategically advantageous, but I don't think that it is alone in that regard. I also don't for a second think that the US is above doing something like this on any sort of legal or moral grounds.)

What I do think, though, is that Norway or Sweden or Finland could have pulled off an operation like this, and have plenty of motivation to do so. And I think that if they did do so, there's no reason they would not advise the US of this. And I also think that the US intelligence community would be happy to help muddy the waters and look capable and audacious if that helped keep a more vulnerable ally out of the spotlight.

From Hersh's own account, it could easily have been Norway that did it at that same time, and none of the supporting evidence would need to change. Only the narrative spun by a single source makes the pieces point to the Biden administration.

We don't know. Neither does Hersh. All any of us can do is spin narratives that stitch together possible scenarios and then look for ways to fit other data to the resulting curves.

The one thing I can say is that whether or not the story turns out to be accurate, I am even less inclined to trust Hersh than I was before the story. He's being reckless, and that is not a good ethos for an investigative journalist.

[Girl from the North Country]

What nous says seems very sensible to me. Particularly this:

The best that the source can hope to achieve is to damage US relations with Russia and Germany and stir up the RW media to attack Biden. That seems to me like a move that is aimed at adding fuel to the Hunter Biden/Blinken/Ukraine circus coming soon to a town near you via the new House leadership.

And this:

For the record, I have no doubt that the US could have done this, and I think that the US finds the destruction of the pipeline strategically advantageous, but I don't think that it is alone in that regard. I also don't for a second think that the US is above doing something like this on any sort of legal or moral grounds.

[bobbyp]

In order to discuss this issue rationally, the first thing we need to do is discard Occam's Razor and enter Hegel's realm of the phenomenonology of pure speculation.

[Pete]

What I do think, though, is that Norway or Sweden or Finland could have pulled off an operation like this, and have plenty of motivation to do so. And I think that if they did do so, there's no reason they would not advise the US of this. And I also think that the US intelligence community would be happy to help muddy the waters and look capable and audacious if that helped keep a more vulnerable ally out of the spotlight.

I dunno who did what (I mean, given the location of the damage these guys look pretty capable). My sense of the Biden administration is that it wants to be a team player, especially following the preceding administration's contempt for NATO and the world in general. And given the region, particularly Sweden/Finland's MAP status and the significant economic repercussions for Germany and the EU, I find it hard to believe that however this went down there weren't at least some backchannel appraisals going on. Still plenty of plausible deniability for all.

I'm kinda curious as to whether Prof. Postal was answering in general, as a professor, or as a science advisor to the Pentagon.

Anyway, this is not My Lai. Dunno what Hersh is trying to achieve here but, even if true to the letter, the timing is lousy. I can't see a positive and it seems like the kind of story that could wait.

[liberal japonicus]

Interesting points. I realize that I fell for a pernicious idée fixe, which is that the US is like a marvel superhero, with powers that no one else has. Hersh sets it up as well, by structuring the piece around the US Navy divers.

[liberal japonicus]

And from LGM.

https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2023/02/quite-a-story-from-a-single-anonymous-source

ouch

[CharlesWT]

Regardless of who did it, it has a monstrous carbon footprint...

[Kenneth Almquist]

Hersh's anonymous source says that the goal was to disable both pairs of pipelines.

Hersh implies that public statements by Biden and Nuland confirm the source's story, but I don't think they do. The Biden and Nuland statements refer to Nord Stream 2 only, not both pairs of pipelines. They can be interpreted as saying that the United States would destroy the Nord Stream 2 pipelines if Germany didn't cancel Nord Stream 2, but Germany did cancel Nord Stream 2.

What actually happened is that three of the four pipelines were disabled, leaving one of the two Nord Stream 2 pipelines intact. This doesn't match the story given by Hersh's anonymous source (who said that all the pipelines were targeted). Nor is it consistent with the notion that the United States went ahead with a plan to attack Nord Stream 2 even though Germany had already canceled it.

It's possible that one of the explosives failed to detonate, but that would mean that the unexploded charge is still there, and nobody has discovered it, or that the United States and Norway managed to remove the unexploded charge without being detected.

Hersh really should have asked his anonymous source about this. Perhaps Hersh's desire to land a big scoop overrode his skepticism.

[wonkie]

I have noticed that sometimes when someone who once preformed services that were brave and important, then goes on hiatus (or out of the limelight) for a while, that person will try to make a comeback that is a failure due to not being up to the previous standard.

He was a hero of mine back in the day. I think this is a failed attempt to once again be the heroic journalist with the big reveal.

[wonkie]

I couldn't really remember why I had such a positive reaction to Hersch so I did a quick google and, oh yeah, now I remember.

BUT! According to WIkipedia he made very dubious claims about the death of Bin Ladin and denied the use of chemical weapons by Assad. I guess he went bonkers a while ago.

Is this a pattern? I mean the person who did great things and then tried to keep center stage by doing things that were a perversion of the great things they used to do?

[wj]

Is this a pattern? I mean the person who did great things and then tried to keep center stage by doing things that were a perversion of the great things they used to do?

I think it depends on how they came to do great things. Specifically how much was ability/talent, vs how much was being in the right place at the right time, i.e. luck. Gotta have luck in any case, of course. But sometimes it is essentially an assist, albeit a critical one, and at the other exteme it can be almost the entire deal.

Those who just got lucky once, but think it was all due to their own brilliance are, I think, particularly prone to the pattern you lay out.

[wj]

Oh, and before I forget:

Ms Green in the office with a chamber pot.

[Nigel]

Can't find the link right now, but someone fact checked Hersch's story against publicly available military vessel movements for the event.
They don't match up very well at all.

Is it a plausible account ? Perhaps.

What about his claim that Biden's earlier references to the pipelines meant that this wasn't a covert operation and thus wouldn't have to be reported to Congress ?
That sounds pretty questionable to me.

[Nigel]

"He was a hero of mine back in the day. I think this is a failed attempt to once again be the heroic journalist with the big reveal."

He's also an older geezer than Biden.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

Back inna day, the old borderline-dementia geezers would be kept at home, where their rants would be politely ignored.

The Free-Range-Geezers movement has a lot to answer for, IMO.

[Girl from the North Country]

(Side, linguistic interpolation:

I've noticed, and now confirmed online, that in the US the word "geezer" seems to indicate old age, whereas in the UK it just means a bloke, with possible connotations of lower class or slight, possibly minorly-criminal dodginess. There are various possibilities, including "diamond geezer" meaning "particularly nice, reliable, good bloke.

I thought this might possibly be of interest, since I remember we had a discussion about "twit", which the Americans thought was a much more scathing insult than it actually is in the UK.)

[hairshirthedonist]

I thought it meant "one who geezes," though I had no idea how one might geez. I've never geezed that I know of and have no knowledge of anyone who has.

[bobbyp]

HSH,
I shall take that under adgeezment.

Elsewhere: OUCH!

Clear and sunny today in Seattle...have a nice day!

[Michael Cain]

...though I had no idea how one might geez.

I think it starts with "Get off my lawn, you darned kids!" Then progresses to "That stuff kids are listening to, that's not music it's just noise!" Shaking a cane without spraining something is covered in advanced classes.

[liberal japonicus]

Interesting! I like etymology online and the geezer entry has this

https://www.etymonline.com/word/geezer

The entry notes that geezer is often qualified by old, which seems to be an example of semantic redundancy, and I feel that there must be other examples, but I can't think of any.

[Bobbyp]

Michael,
Where does “yelling at clouds” fit in that progression?

[Michael Cain]

...though I had no idea how one might geez.

Then there's technical geezerhood. I admit to this one. To the point that I know who to credit for, "Those who don't understand UNIX are doomed to reinvent it, poorly."

http://mcain6925.com/obsidian/dilbert_unix.jpg

[nous]

Here is the classic example of Geezering, taken from Black Sabbath's self titled debut:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l99iwjmaMm4

If you think you are a Geezer, you have a lot to live up to.

[Girl from the North Country]

The entry notes that geezer is often qualified by old, which seems to be an example of semantic redundancy

Presumably only in American usage? I have to say, when I have seen it used on ObWi it clearly seems to mean an old guy, without the adjective. Whereas in the UK it is used unadorned even of quite young men. You'd have to say "an old geezer" if that's what you meant.

Interesting to track it down, though, to see if once it did imply old. From what I can find, it may once have done, but certainly it no longer does. It is fairly common slang in certain social classes and regions, pretty much neutral and interchangeable with "bloke" (although not "chap", which is at the opposite end of the class spectrum), and only qualified by an appropriate adjective as necessary.

[Michael Cain]

Where does “yelling at clouds” fit in that progression?

Beyond category? At least in my book, geezerhood is defined by criticizing young(er) people.

I have a friend who lives outside Sante Fe whose dog has always barked at contrails.

[Pro Bono]

I confirm what GftNC says about the connotations of 'geezer' hereabouts. It seems that it comes from 'guiser', meaning 'actor'.

I think I mostly used it of unknown male bridge opponents "the geezer led the ace of diamonds". It's unlikely to refer to a young man, but it doesn't imply that he's old.

[wj]

I'm guessing that, in America, we used "old geezer" for a while. And then simply truncated the expression to just "geezer", but with the connotation of age still implied. Rather like application has been truncated to "app", radical to "rad", etc.

Truncation -- it's what we do.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

"Truncation -- it's what we do."

U R tots rite.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

Back to the OP: "Colonel Mustard in the bathroom with a wrench"

reminds me of some plumbing work to be done. Dammit.

[Michael Cain]

...reminds me of some plumbing work to be done. Dammit.

I remember once at Home Depot checking out with a bunch of plumbing bits and the young woman finished with, "Have a nice day!" I pointed out that I was purchasing plumbing bits, so was going to spend the rest of the day working on plumbing, so it was impossible that my day would be nice.

[wj]

I was purchasing plumbing bits, so was going to spend the rest of the day working on plumbing, so it was impossible that my day would be nice.

Seems like, if the plumbing only took 2-3 hours, rather than 6-8, that would qualify as a nice day. At least, far nicer than expected. (Admittedly, if you ended up back at Home Depot a couple of times, trying to get the right plumbing bit, that would be bad.)

[bobbyp]

Going to the hardware store four times during the day to find parts that actually mate together is a great way to get out of the house.

[Michael Cain]

Going to the hardware store four times during the day to find parts that actually mate together is a great way to get out of the house.

True story, this. We moved to Colorado early in 1988. In 2018, when I had to fix a small plumbing problem, I went through the box of plumbing parts I had accumulated over many years and found precisely the fitting I needed. The amusing part is the price sticker on it was proof that it had been purchased in New Jersey before we moved to Colorado.

I think I've mentioned in the past about exposure at an impressionable age to my grandparents who lived in the poorest part of Iowa during the Great Depression?

[liberal japonicus]

I think I've mentioned in the past about exposure at an impressionable age to my grandparents who lived in the poorest part of Iowa during the Great Depression?

I'm not sure what it is like now, but about 20 years ago, my mom got entranced by Las Vegas. The Hawaii side of my family (and apparently a lot of other Japanese Americans) like gambling, so the family reunion was planned for there. My mom grumbled, but hit when she tried the slots and was hooked. So hooked that when I asked my folks to come to Eugene to meet my future wife, she said how about meeting us in Las Vegas?

This is all preliminary to an observation, when we went to the buffets, they all had 1930's decor. There is a similar vibe, I believe, with Cracker Barrel and perhaps some other similar places.

I think that this is in part to try and contrast the plenty available with poverty of that time, which works with the kids of those grandparents. I wonder at what point it will change.

[wj]

Our parents, and their generation, saved everything -- whether it really might be useful or not. After all, a one in a million chance is still a chance. And they were accustomed to spending the minimum, even after things picked up in the mid-20th century.

Our generation picked up those habits of saving stuff. But mostly had enough that we didn't have our parents' habit of spending the minimum.

As a result, the next generation accumulated stuff. But it was generally new bought stuff, and replaced when even newer stuff came along. While regarding our habit of amassing attics and garages and spare rooms full of old, used, stuff as somewhere between odd and downright weird.

Now? The saving habits of the current generation would be unrecognizable to any of our parents' who are still around. Or maybe the word is incomprehensible.**

The current pattern seems unlikely to change until and unless we see something like the Great Depression again. That is, a bad economy with no end in sight. Even the "Great Recession" was viewed, by most people living thru it, as temporary. They (we) reined in our spending for the duration, but didn't save/recycle/repurpose everything that came to hand.

** Our parents show amazing adaptability when it comes to using new technology. (During covid, the annual New Years gathering shifted to Zoom. As for every other use, less than totally unsatisfactory but far better than nothing. And 90 year olds apparently fine with it.) But the change in spending and saving habits is a very different deal for them.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

Plumbing job DONE.
Only two trips to Home Despot, first to get the replacement part, second to get a BFW (big f'n wrench) to get the crusty old part off, so it could be replaced.

Splash-test PASSED.

[wj]

second to get a BFW (big f'n wrench) to get the crusty old part off,

Sometimes, even today, those old Depression era habits are a plus. We obviously don't need all my Dad's tools, plus all my father-in-law's tools -- why would we need five (5!) socket sets??? But somewhere the garage is a BFW, in the unlikely even we want to lay our hands on one.

[Michael Cain]

But somewhere the garage is a BFW, in the unlikely even we want to lay our hands on one.

When we moved two years ago, I intentionally left the inherited BFW behind. The townhouse is new and every bit of plumbing in it is PEX on the supply side and PVC on the drain side. If something goes wrong that would need a BFW, I'll pay for the plumber.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

"I'll pay for the plumber."

I sometimes wonder if the reported quotation from Einstein "I should have been a plumber" was a result of facing a plumber's bill for his house in Princeton NJ, or the more conventional explanation of

"Nuclear destruction of humanity, or doing plumbing? Eh, okay, I guess that's the ONE case where 'plumbing' wins"

[wj]

One other reason why our parents saved stuff: no planned obsolescence.

This occurred to me when I realized what shirt I was wearing. Men's shirts are typically sturdier than women's blouses. But after a decade of being worn every week or so, the collars get seriously frayed. (As do the cuffs on long sleeved shirts.)

But this one is still in great condition after 50 years. And I don't think it's because, or at least not only because, it's MilSpec.** Stuff was just routinely made sturdier then.

** For those who haven't encountered the term, MilSpec (military specification) was (is?) a reference to something that is seriously over-engineered. Need a frame for a 5 ton vehicle? Specify one which can handle 25 tons. That way, if you have to drop it out of a plane, it will hit the ground, bounce, and be just fine. It's the approach that results in Mars rovers that keep going months beyond their (nominal) design life. Or why the Voyagers are still working, and sending back data, decades after their original mission was completed.

[nous]

On the subject of planned obsolescence and differing attitudes, I've been trying to put together a weekend backpacking/bug out kit for us, and it's challenging to find things that I think will stand up to use. The outdoors market is obsessed with the Instagrammable outdoors, which means either that it's aimed at the "glamping" hipster van life crowd or the "fast and light" extreme sport crowd - filling their feeds with envy or FKT respectively.

Harder to find light enough stuff that is built not for one through hike, but for many seasons of mindful use. And I really prioritize this niche even more today because this is also the sustainable approach, both for the environment and for wise spending.

Yes, I'm going to be hauling a bit more weight, but not that much. I'll just slow down a bit and plan accordingly.

[JanieM]

nous -- I'm decades behind the times on camping equipment, but does even REI not have the kind of thing you're looking for in its vast offerings? That would be disappointing.

[hairshirthedonist]

I don't know how you can think about camping when we're being invaded by extraterrestrials.

[wj]

I don't know how you can think about camping when we're being invaded by extraterrestrials.

Self preservation. In their own society, extraterrestrials would, inevitability, be part of their own urban elites. So when they invade, of course they would focus on terrestial cities. Being out in the wilderness would let you avoid their attention.

[Pete]

The REI stuff I have is pretty good although I don't have a lot of stuff from them. But the usual principles apply: Light, Cheap, and Durable. Pick any two.

And aren't abductees always taken out in the woods somewhere? No one ever gets abducted in midtown Manhattan. Well, not by aliens, anyway.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

The abductees are always taken from vehicles, where the aliens kill the motor to prevent escape.

Hikers in the wilderness are safe from aliens.

Bigfoot, on the other hand...

[Pete]

why would we need five (5!) socket sets???

I guess I need a more precise definition of "set", but: imperial, metric, hex, deep socket, breaker bars, extensions, 3/8" drive, 1/2" drive, angle adapters...

But yeah, so many things just aren't designed to be fixed anymore. I don't think of myself as a hoarder and I hate clutter. But I also hate the idea of things ending up in a landfill, so I try to fix and/or repurpose whatever I can. Granted, it's easier to do here than in an urban environment where space is at a premium.

I don't have any PEX tools/fittings. Yet. But I'm only delaying the inevitable. I don't like the waste involved, but it's soooo much easier to work with. Not to mention: no torches and flux and solder and emery and all the other fun stuff that goes along with copper/brass.

[nous]

JanieM - Heh, I'm actually a product reviewer for REI (they send me stuff to try, I review it and get to keep it). I've been a loyal customer for almost 40 years. But REI lives in the same market and the same media environment as the rest of us and they have to choose from what the gear manufacturers are producing. Right now the two hot market segments are luxury camping and the extreme sportification of backpacking.

The gear review websites do gear shootouts every year and award one piece for being a bit lighter and more compact, and then pick a second for its price point as a best buy. But it's always a comparison with a small window and the next year it is all new gear again. You don't get much of an idea how well the gear lasts over time, just over intensive, short-term use. So a lot of the gear I actually prefer gets shunted into the middle of the pack and gets described as heavier and less cutting edge.

REI gets those shoppers after they have already gone to the websites and read over the shootouts. They come with cups full, looking for the gear that hit the seasonal trend.

That or they get the people hoping to build a following on social media with their instagrammable outdoor glamour life.

I tend to look for the gear that has lasted in the market for decades with minor change and tolerate a bit more weight or space taken up for the sake of getting something I know will serve for many years and in unexpected circumstances - Katadyn Pocket Filter, MSR Whisperlight stove, REI Half Dome tent, Thermarest self inflating pad... I just replaced one rainshell because I could not abide the oh so trendy two layer laminate design. Yes, a liner adds weight. It's also more comfortable and takes the wear and dirt off of the membrane.

It's ten times worse looking for running shoes. There's almost no room left for shoes that are not on-trend. Ugh, rocker soles and carbon plates...

At the heart of it all, for me though, is the idea of sustainability. Recycled materials are fine - if they work and they last. Only having to ever buy something once and having it last a lifetime of use is its own form of sustainability.

[wj]

At the heart of it all, for me though, is the idea of sustainability. Recycled materials are fine - if they work and they last. Only having to ever buy something once and having it last a lifetime of use is its own form of sustainability.

Critically, if it's getting recycled, that takes resources, too. So, if it doesn't last (that is, if it has to be recycled frequently) that's a negative for sustainability. Especially if only parts of it are recycled.

[JanieM]

It's ten times worse looking for running shoes. There's almost no room left for shoes that are not on-trend. Ugh, rocker soles and carbon plates...

Interesting to hear about your adventures as a product reviewer.

As to shoes ... try being ancient, and wanting sneakers but not for running....

The last kind I found that worked for me (about 18 months ago), I bought five pairs in 4 colors. Now I don't have to go on another one of those quests for years.

[Pete]

There's almost no room left for shoes that are not on-trend.

Speaking of Merrell...

:::grumblegrumble:::

[CharlesWT]

There are a number of items I wish I had bought a decade or so supply of when I had the opportunity.

[Michael Cain]

But yeah, so many things just aren't designed to be fixed anymore.

A few years back a friend was asking what he should get for a nephew about to go off to college. My suggestion, which he followed, was a good bicycle multitool, a small pair of clamping pliers, two pair of forceps (one straight, one curved), and a pair of side cutters. Put 'em all in a small flat Rubber Maid container. The friend heard back from his sister after dorm move-in day and said not only had her son used most of them, he was immediately popular because he had tools.

[CaseyL]

I have a North Face backpack that I've had for, oh, 30 (?) odd years... hard to remember when I got it. It's been just about everywhere, on hikes and on international trips. Still looks just fine, zippers work and everything.

(As an aside: you might want to check out Filson's. Their camping gear is still made out of leather and canvas - unfortunately, last I checked, they still used buckles, too. They are VERY pricy, but you will never need to buy another bag. And you may be able to find some used ones on EBay and the like.)

OTOH, I had to replace a dishwasher a couple of years ago, and the new one stopped working almost exactly one month after its warranty expired. I am so pissed off I can't tell you.

Planned obsolescence makes me incandescently angry, because now it's teamed up with price gouging: If you want a dishwasher that works, and will continue to work throughout its expected lifetime, be prepared to pay nearly $2000 for one.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

Dishwashers are very complicated machines, it doesn't surprise me at all that they break down, but it does surprise me that they're relatively inexpensive compared to the complexity.

OTOH, a gas stove, which is just some tubes and valves, are often priced MUCH higher than dishwashers.

All the more reason to kill off gas stoves, and induction is better anyway.

[nous]

The North Face still makes some sturdy packs. The trick is finding out which ones the local outdoor retailer carries and trying to ensure that the one they carry is one of the sturdy ones. A lot of the slick, modern ones have 70 denier cloth on the body and 300 on the boot to save weight and cost, but I wouldn't trust one of those for hard use or for years of service.

Sure feels comfy and the weight makes the hike a lot easier, but I'm never going to trust that something unexpected won't come up and make me regret the compromise in durability at the least forgiving time.

I don't do anything super challenging these days. We're more lodge hikers than backpackers, but I'm not going to get caught out without the essentials in case something bad happens.

[CaseyL]

Snarki - I don't think Dishwashers are a lot more complicated than washing machines (they do essentially the same thing), which work without complaining for years.

Mind you, washing machines are wildly expensive these days, too.

[novakant]

But after a decade of being worn every week or so, the collars get seriously frayed.

My problem is getting the grey stuff out of the collars - any foolproof tips? Thanks.

[Michael Cain]

The hard problem washing machines have that dishwashers don't is dealing with tens of pounds of mass rotating at high speed, often in an unbalanced arrangement.

The really bad thing about contemporary household appliances is that their longevity is largely determined by the lifetime of the electrolytic capacitors used in the AC-to-DC power converter needed to run the electronics. Want to change this for the better? Pass a law saying those converters must be separate from the electronics themselves, and use standard voltage levels so it can be easily replaced. No more, "Oh, a two-dollar capacitor failed, you'll have to replace the entire $300-plus-labor electronics board."

[wj]

My problem is getting the grey stuff out of the collars - any foolproof tips?

The "grey stuff" is, I believe, organics from sweat. The best I've got is, avoid light colors, especially white.** (In particular, if you know you are going to be doing anything where you sweat a lot.) It doesn't get rid of the grey stuff, but it makes it hard to see.

** Actually, if you wear lots of white shirts, you can go with the same approach you use for t-shirts: bleach.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

There's a reason that GigaByte advertises that their motherboards are made with "solid Japanese capacitors".

Slightly more expensive, but don't dry out and fail like cheaper electrolytics.

If novakant has problems with "ring-around-the-collar" (shades of yesteryear!) there's lots of internet advice out there. Try some and let us know the results!

Ye olde-timey shirts had detachable collars, just for that reason.

[wj]

Breaking news: Senator Feinstein has officially announced that she will not seek reelect6. Not unexpected. But still, it means we here in California can get serious about speculating which two Democrats** will top the primary in 2024 and procede to the general election.

** Yes, the Republicans could settle early on a single candidate. And that single candidate could be relatively moderate; enough so to get to the general election. But that's not the way the smart money bets here.

[nous]

On the D side of the CA senate race what I've seen is Schiff in the lead with Porter a not too distant second. I think Schiff has the money and establishment advantage in the primary since he's been in Dem leadership longer and Porter doesn't accept PAC money, but if Porter can secure the #2 spot, I expect she will pick up votes in the general with more populist mojo and less partisan antipathy.

[wj]

Certainly there would be some voting against Schiff. Although I'm not so sure that Porter being notably progressive wouldn't be a pretty big negative for the same crowd. Unless TFG is at the head of the ticket (or there's some hot button propositoon on the ballot), a lot of them might just stay home.

[Michael Cain]

There's a reason that GigaByte advertises that their motherboards are made with "solid Japanese capacitors".

50,000 hour capacitors -- what they claim -- is still less than six years when powered up 24/7. Nor are they power supply capacitors, subject to all the nasties in the 120VAC US mains. I still want the separately replaceable DC power supply in my household appliances.

[Pete]

I’m Team Whiteboard. But I’ve heard Pelosi is pushing for Maloney as Labor Secretary over Su, so Schiff will probably have the D machine behind him. So I’m making myself one with disappointment. Not that I’d have a problem with Schiff. I just like Porter more. It’ll be interesting if they’re the final 2.

[nous]

Porter is notably progressive, but her consumer advocate side and Wall Street whiteboardings may get her some independents who think Schiff will be another corporate Dem like Feinstein.

Porter isn't progressive in the same way that The Squad is progressive. More like Warren, but without the scolding. Could win the more moderate, labor-oriented swing voters.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

Many Gigabyte mobos, over many years, never saw a cap fail. Not the case for MCI, Intel, others I've since forgotten.

Some, I replaced the failed caps and got a few more years out of them. Then replaced with a Gigabyte.

I suspect that the "big electrolytics" you're thinking of are from old-style transformer+rectifier+filter power supplies, not the more modern switching power supplies. In both cases, you don't put AC *through* your electrolytic caps, unless you want them to explode, which *is* fun, with all the confetti.

It's a different situation for motor-start caps; bad memories of doing that to get a 3-phase motor running on 2-phase power. But I don't think that's what is being referred to.

Most power supplies *are* modular, because manufacturers prefer to just buy a module instead of designing their own; it just requires some digging to figure out specs of the power supply module, and where you can get a replacement. Having most of the manufacturing base overseas helps not one tiny bit.

[Michael Cain]

Snarki, I think you're wrong about appliances, at least in the US. There's a "main control board". At one end of it are all the components for what could be a separate modular power supply. Some front-end protection against noise in the AC mains. Bridge rectifier, a big bulk filter cap or two, then all of the stuff for a switching power supply. At the other end of the board is the processor, relays, and a bunch of connectors to the wiring harness. When the power supply end fails after eight years or so of continuous operation, the whole board has to be replaced.

If you're lucky. When our refrigerator died, it was the power supply end of the board and because it was a board that was used in several different brands, our appliance repair guy had his own personal stash of a dozen or so. My friend the amateur chef had a $1500 induction range/oven. The board failed after eight years. The manufacturer had discontinued board production after five and the spare-parts inventory had been exhausted. His choices were a reworked used board, or replace the range.

I assert that every appliance maker should be required to put complete specs for every board in escrow, to be placed in the public domain when they halt production.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

"I assert that every appliance maker should be required to put complete specs for every board in escrow, to be placed in the public domain when they halt production."

Agreed, including a Bill of Materials and PCB artwork. But I have fixed a few devices where the internal p/s was modular. And some where it wasn't. It might have been a matter of having a 'legacy' design with their own p/s.

Induction ranges are great, but the inside does look a lot like a PC, except that Newegg doesn't have parts, dammit.

[Michael Cain]

But I have fixed a few devices where the internal p/s was modular.

Bless their pointy little heads. There may be hope after all.

[Pro Bono]

I suspect that the "big electrolytics" you're thinking of are from old-style transformer+rectifier+filter power supplies, not the more modern switching power supplies...

Switched-mode power supplies start with a rectifier and a smoothing capacitor (and some fancy electronics). Or at least they did last time I was paying attention.

[Girl from the North Country]

I think this is the closest thing we have to an open thread, so for anybody who didn't have enough archaic flummery at the funeral of the late Queen (where I discovered a previously unguessed ambition to be, or at least dress like, Rouge Dragon Pursuivant), there is today in the Times a piece about all the historic roles for various aristocrats at past (and forthcoming) coronations, and I particularly liked this one, which put me very much in mind of The Once and Future King:

Not everyone applying for a role has a title. Francis Dymoke, 68, is an accountant-turned-farmer who lives in Lincolnshire. Dymoke’s ancestors have been the King’s champion since Robert de Marmion, his 34th great-grandfather, was at the side of William the Conqueror on his coronation on Christmas Day in 1066. Since then the role of Dymokes — the right is attached to the land they own, rather than the family itself (but fortunately they have been farming the same land for nearly a thousand years) — has been to ride into the banquet at Westminster Hall, throw down a gauntlet and see if anyone wanted to challenge him.

With no charger, and no banquet, that will not be happening on May 6. “My father carried the Union flag in a procession at the last coronation,” he said. “So basically I’m applying for that.”

[wj]

to ride into the banquet at Westminster Hall, throw down a gauntlet and see if anyone wanted to challenge him.

One has to wonder what would happen, in this day and age, if someone were to take up the gauntlet. I mean, there would obviously be a crisis -- I guess we can't call it a "Constitutional crisis", although that was the phrase that leapt to my mind. But what would happen in the moment? Does Dymoke even know how to use a sword?

[Girl from the North Country]

Does Dymoke even know how to use a sword?

It seems his family has actually beaten their swords into ploughshares. How satisfyingly biblical.

[wj]

"We shall have a duel; King's Champion vs challenger. Plowshares at 10 paces!"

[Snarki, child of Loki]

Perhaps Jeremy Clarkson could turn up with an entirely-too-large-and-fancy tractor.

It's the modern form of a "plowshare", right?

[CharlesWT]

What is the capacity of a ploughshares magazine?...

[wj]

What is the capacity of a ploughshares magazine?...

About 8,000 words on average. (It has a rather limited readership.)

[Girl from the North Country]

On a separate matter, I just want to say while he is still alive how moving I find Jimmy Carter's general demeanour, attitude towards death, and actually almost everything else about him. He may not have been a great president, but I think he really is a great man, and a properly impressive human being. I wish there were more like him.

[wj]

He may not have been a great president, but I think he really is a great man, and a properly impressive human being

Not a great President (although not a terrible one either). But arguably our all-time greatest ex-President. Certainly one of the top two.

[Michael Cain]

...attitude towards death...

When my mother died at 92, I know one of the contributing factors was that she had simply outlived her friends who were contemporary. My sister said that it struck her particularly hard a few years earlier when she had written to the school district of the small Iowa town where she went to high school, asking why she hadn't gotten the usual letter about reunion classes, and the response was, "You're it, Phyllis. Everyone but you in that class has died."

I know the critics hated Bicentennial Man, but I thought Robin Williams was excellent as (essentially) an AI that grows tired of outliving the humans it cares about.

[CharlesWT]

Carter wasn't a great president but, from my point of view, a number of good things happen during his administration. Maybe those things' times had come but I'm willing to give him some credit.

[Nigel]

I think Cartef a fad better President than he's given credit for. - though that assessment has already improved somewhat.
He wasn't a great President, principally because he failed to get reelected.

[CharlesWT]

Carter may not have been reelected due to his appointment of Paul Volcker as the head of the Federal Reserve. Volcker implemented tight monetary policies to combat inflation, which was a departure from Nixon's inflationary policies. Although it was successful in reducing inflation, it also resulted in a painful recession.

[liberal japonicus]

I agree with Nigel, a lot of the programs that Reagan gets credit for were actually initiated by Carter, and if he had another term, I'd like to think that we would be remembering him in the same way that so many people (not me!) get the warm fuzzies when they think about Reagan. Reagan never had to go into a nuclear power plant that was on the verge of melting down...
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/chalk-river-nuclear-accident-1.6293574