Georgia on My Mind

by wj

Mine, and yours as well, I suspect. We can devote the comments on Tuesday to speculation (in my case, mostly uninformed speculation) on the outcome of the Senate races. And on Wednesday, or maybe later, we can focus on what actually happened. Once we know.

For inspiration: the man himself
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DFhuE_XeT8

Comments

[wj]

My guess is that the Democratic candidates both pull it out.

What puts them over the edge is that, for the last two days of the campaign, the Republican candidates could hardly get any attention -- because the local news in Georgia has been pretty much wall to wall on the Trump phone call. Well, that's what happens when you get in bed with Trump.

[Girl from the North Country]

wj: FYLTGE

[cleek]

he does have a way of making everything about him, as he rubs his ass all over it.

[doretta]

I, too, hope wj is right but it's all going to hinge on how many Trump voters show up today-and they do seem to be motivated. They aren't likely watching the local news, so I'm not sure that is going to help.

[wj]

With a whole 5% (give or take) of the estimated votes counted, both Democrats are leading. Which is meaningless, but hey, when you've got no solid data....

[wj]

A straw in the wind.
https://mobile.twitter.com/Taniel/status/1346631145631444992

[wj]

Sometimes, pundits on the right get the analysis correct. This from Ramesh Ponnuru:

My sense is Perdue and Loeffler could have survived any 2 of these 3: being unimpressive candidates, GA shifting purple, and Trump being a maniac.

Unfortunately for them, they had a trifecta. (And yes, that does mean I think it's settled. Except for the size of the margins.)

[Priest]

We did it. 2010 was a backlash against Obama's win. Tonight was an indication that backlashes can go in different directions. Will add more in the next few days, if I can.

[cleek]

With a whole 5% (give or take) of the estimated votes counted, both Democrats are leading.

and they're leading with 99% of the votes counted, too.

of course these days, it ain't over until the last vote has been counted, at least twice. and even then, the GOP isn't going to accept the result because #handwaving.

[Girl from the North Country]

And since Perdue has stated he will exhaust all legal avenues to "be sure all legal votes are counted", I am assuming that for as long as they drag that out they can stymie progress in the Senate? Because until Ossoff is confirmed winner, won't it still be R 50 v D 49?

[bobbyp]

TGFNC,

Biden won Georgia by 12k votes. Ossoff's lead is currently 16k. This will be a done deal by the time Biden is sworn in.

When you even managed to lose Douthat, well......

[Girl from the North Country]

What you say makes sense, but nothing would surprise me at this point, so I hope you're right, bobbyp.

[Priest]

If Murkowski would pull a Jeffords, things would roll smoothly along.

[sapient]

Happy day! I'm pretty sure this is done!

[bobbyp]

I agree with this take.

Good luck, Joe.

[hairshirthedonist]

From bobbyp's link:

Historical irony: the runoff in statewide elections was a ‘reform’ designed to make it harder for non-Jim Crow candidates to win. Without the runoffs, Republicans keep the Senate. WOMP WOMP!

Noice!

[Michael Cain]

This will be a done deal by the time Biden is sworn in.

From memory, Georgia counties have until the 15th to certify their counts, and the SoS has until the 22nd. Candidates can request a recount during the two business days following certification if the results are within 0.5%. McConnell will, of course, refuse to seat Ossoff until any recount is finished.

[wj]

It does seem to be a thing at the moment: stuff done by Republicans to tilt the playing field in their favor keep coming back to bite them in the @ss. If your religion doesn't have Karma, think of it as "As ye sow, so shall ye reap."

Because I'm getting better at imagining the unimaginable, I'm thinking about what McConnell might try to pull in the next two weeks -- while he's still got VP Pence as the tie-breaker. And how loudly he will object when the Democrats do the same back at him.

[McKinneyTexas]

My sense is Perdue and Loeffler could have survived any 2 of these 3: being unimpressive candidates, GA shifting purple, and Trump being a maniac.

Trump and Lin Woods' outsized role in turning the Republican party into a parody of conservatism cannot be understated. The long list of enablers, Gingrich, Cruz, Hawley, Graham and so on have more to answer for than they can ever accomplish in one lifetime.

And they will never, not in a million years, accept responsibility or even remotely acknowledge their contribution.

So, the ball is now in your court amigos. Let's see how it plays out. You won fair and square. Good luck.

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

"You won fair and square."

You can't be so objective, unbiased, and pristinely and evenly balanced that you aren't able to realize that you have won .... somewhat ... as well, can you?

[Girl from the North Country]

Good luck, Joe, may the force be with you. And may all the Dems (and any principled Rs who remain and aren't going to run again) be disciplined enough to stay with you long enough to enact measures to make America a place which doesn't seek to disenfranchise minorities, stoke religious and racial hatred, and enrich the already sufficiently (or obscenely) rich at the expense of the working poor. Helping to save the planet, invest in infrastructure, and mend fences with your traditional allies, would also be an excellent idea. Luckily,, I think you and some of your peeps are up for it.

[cleek]

Trump and Lin Woods' outsized role in turning the Republican party into a parody of conservatism cannot be understated.

yup.

Lin Wood, today

MUST BE DONE LIST before Congress meets today:

1. Mike Pence @vp
@Mike_Pence must resign & thereafter be charged with TREASON.

2. Rod Rosenstein
@RodRosenstein must be arrested & charged with being accessory to murder & TREASON.

3. Chief Justice John Roberts must RESIGN.

the GOP is not sending its best.

or maybe it is.

[Girl from the North Country]

I would have thought McConnell deserves a place at the head of your list of infamy, McKinney.

[mck]

You can't be so objective, unbiased, and pristinely and evenly balanced that you aren't able to realize that you have won .... somewhat ... as well, can you?

I'm keeping as open a mind as my human limitations will allow. My preference was for gridlock. I didn't get it. It's democracy, not McKTocracy.

the GOP is not sending its best.

or maybe it is.

No. The best are Sasse, Romney and the various state Repubs who told Trump and his posse to pound sand.

I would have thought McConnell deserves a place at the head of your list of infamy, McKinney.

No, McConnell only stirs up the 20% or so on the left who follow this shit day in and day out. For the rest of American, he's just another senator who does was senators do.

Also, it's my sense that McConnell would have loved to have done Trump in years ago but didn't have a way to pull it off. I think the thing that so many of us didn't get was how many people Trump could suborn to his personal crew. It is cult-like. I always thought Cleek was being over-the-top melodramatic (and I'm not sure I'm entirely wrong about that), but he got that one right.

[McKinneyTexas]

That was me hitting send too soon.

[CaseyL]

Also, it's my sense that McConnell would have loved to have done Trump in years ago but didn't have a way to pull it off.

How quickly we forget, when we want to.

McConnell could have done T* in back in January 2020, by insisting on the impeachment trial being an actual, you know, trial. With witness testimony. And he can twist arms when he wants to, rather than stating from the start that the Senate GOP was "as one" with the Trump Administration.

Y'all had the chance to send Trump packing, and decided not to.

[hairshirthedonist]

No, McConnell only stirs up the 20% or so on the left who follow this shit day in and day out. For the rest of American, he's just another senator who does was senators do.

But what about what he's actually done rather than how he's popularly perceived? I know GFTNC used the word "infamy," but you didn't. And I don't know that the others on your list stir up any more people than does McConnell, or that they aren't seen by the rest as senators doing what senators do.

[CharlesWT]

My preference was for gridlock.

Also the libertarian preference.

[Hartmut]

You'll still get a lot of it, don't be too worried.

As for McTurtle, I think he would have vastly preferred Pence and if he had seen a way to replace Jabbabonk with him, he'd have done it. But he knew that would have carried a literal not just figurative risk of getting murdered and that his gang would have the same fears. So why risk his life if the chances of success were slim in the first place? Plus, I think even he did not expect HOW counterproductive Jabbabonk would become in the end.

[McKinneyTexas]

How quickly we forget, when we want to.

McConnell could have done T* in back in January 2020, by insisting on the impeachment trial being an actual, you know, trial. With witness testimony. And he can twist arms when he wants to, rather than stating from the start that the Senate GOP was "as one" with the Trump Administration.

Y'all had the chance to send Trump packing, and decided not to.

Ok, sure, of course you're right. McConnell had the pull and the horses to dump Trump. And, so did I, except I'm not a Republican.

If you have any memory of what I wrote at the time, I made two general arguments. First, that Trump was guilty of impeachable offenses and, second, it would be great if McConnell could pull off a quiet agreement that Trump steps down, isn't prosecuted and Pence steps in. That obviously never happened and I think any rational, objective, non-hyperpartisan can see in hindsight that the Trump Crew was so in the can for DT that Mitch, Romney et al would never have gotten to the plate much less first base on deposing DT. But, sure, hold everyone who isn't a lefty responsible for the fact that DT wasn't impeached.

[cleek]

Trump and Lin Woods' outsized role in turning the Republican party into a parody of conservatism cannot be understated.

more on this...

while i don't subscribe to it, and wouldn't want to live under it, i do think conservatism is a valid philosophy and its probably workable.

what's really blown me away about the Trump era is how little force it took to blow all of the conservatism out of the mainstream GOP. his nomination and the immediate gushing support he got from evangelicals and other movement conservatives was the first sign. but then they stuck with him through things that no other Republican could have ever weathered. and not just stuck with him - everything he did made them love him more. nothing, not even their conservative principles, could keep them from adoring him.

without even trying, he completely de-legitimized the current GOP as a conservative party. oh sure, they're all going to go back to pretending to be conservative as soon as Trump leaves DC - they know all the old conservative show stoppers by heart. but we will all know they're just phoning it in.

maybe Sasse and Romney and the other handful can bring it back to reason. but i suspect most of those guys are going to end up on the discard pile, next primary season.

I always thought Cleek was being over-the-top melodramatic (and I'm not sure I'm entirely wrong about that), but he got that one right

i think i've said it here before, but i agree with this. i was being a bit hyperbolic at first. but, over the last few months especially, the GOP has more than confirmed it.

[McKinneyTexas]

But what about what he's actually done rather than how he's popularly perceived?

My hyper-engaged Republican/Conservative friends can rattle off a litany of high crimes and misdemeanors they impute to Pelosi, AOC, Schumer et al. I see the flip side of it here.

From where I sit, most of the kerfuffle is on matters of process, peripheral substance and appearance ("Did you hear what AOC said!?!?!?!?!!?"). I'm not that deep in the weeds, so what yanks your chain about McConnell probably doesn't get me very worked up just like I don't lose a lot of sleep over Pelosi or Schumer. I kind of like AOC because she's still so new to all of this, she almost always says what's on her mind.

If you think back on what gets me going, it isn't personalities per se(DT being a major exception), but rather issues/policies/etc. I can get pretty amped up over speech codes, sex codes, tax policy, defending free enterprise, etc. I seldom worry much about individuals.

Except BobbyP. Commie sandbagger who most likely manicures his handicap. He scares me.

[russell]

So, the ball is now in your court amigos. Let's see how it plays out. You won fair and square. Good luck.

Thanks McK!

To the degree that I can ‘speak for the left’, I’ll offer my hope that we don’t fubar things too badly. IMO just lowering the crazy factor will be an improvement.

Better days, soon come.

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

Ham sandwich. Yum.

https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-national-courts-national-governments-courts-government-and-politics-0ca758127e3b1718bc08c056b409959d

Garland merely receiving a hearing in the Senate will, in these low bar times, seem like the Berlin Wall coming down.

We still have gridlock. There is not a landslide for miles around.

Ski the bunny slopes with no fear.

[McKinneyTexas]

I was going to pick some of the better quotes from Cleek's 12:11, but since that turned out to be me just reprinting the whole thing, I will simply say this: Yes, everything you say is correct.

This is such a bizarre thing and a bizarre time to be a conservative who likes the Constitution (the whole thing, not just the bits that work in my favor) and gets it that not everyone agrees with me (which is somewhat weird, but I've come to accept that hard fact).

My wife and I are actively rethinking our plans for the next several years because my views--I'm not particularly shy--will likely have very real social ramifications. I never, ever thought things could get this way.

[Girl from the North Country]

What about the issue of refusing hearings for Merryck Garland, and any SCOTUS nominees of President HRC? I would have thought you might have had an opinion on that, McKinney. Or do you happily ignore that as a matter of "process"?

[Girl from the North Country]

Merrick

[liberal japonicus]

From this link
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/01/06/republicans-turn-on-trump-georgia-loss-455305

Behind the scenes, Georgia Republicans were also frustrated that Donald Trump Jr., the president’s son and one of the GOP’s most popular surrogates, backed out of appearances in the state on the Sunday before the election. Perdue personally asked for Trump to reconsider, but Sen. Tim Scott (R-S.C.) stepped in instead.

Realizing that Tim Scott is a tad bit more on the, err, earth tones than DT jr, I wonder if those rallies played out like this scene in Blazing Saddles

https://youtu.be/dQrrqf-YamA?t=62

[cleek]

that's Merrick FUCKING Garland. :)

and he's gonna be the next attorney general.

[Girl from the North Country]

But actually, I don't want to get in the way of your introspection. So although I regard McConnell as a scoundrel, a blackguard, a piece of ordure to be wiped off one's shoe with a shudder, anybody else is at entire liberty (of course) to disagree.

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

"My wife and I are actively rethinking our plans for the next several years because my views--I'm not particularly shy--will likely have very real social ramifications."

One day, perhaps you can unpack that for us.

[wj]

McKinney is well on the conservative side here. But I can see how, in Texas, he might be considered a flaming liberal, if not an outright socialist. (Texas may be changing. But big swaths of it haven't yet.)

[sapient]

So although I regard McConnell as a scoundrel, a blackguard, a piece of ordure to be wiped off one's shoe with a shudder

A description of McConnell to be memorized and repeated endlessly. Thank you GftNC!

[Donald]

“ My wife and I are actively rethinking our plans for the next several years because my views--I'm not particularly shy--will likely have very real social ramifications. I never, ever thought things could get this way.”

That I am curious about. What do you mean?

I read Dreher regularly, but Dreher is a twerp and he cherry picks to boost whatever hysterical kick he is on. At the same time, I think there are various types of cancel culture, left and right, if that is what you are referring to.

Speaking of which, I am glad Warnock won, but his behavior on the Israeli Palestinian issue has been contemptible. He was criticized by bigots and caved in completely. I might provide links later.

[McKinneyTexas]

What about the issue of refusing hearings for Merryck Garland, and any SCOTUS nominees of President HRC? I would have thought you might have had an opinion on that, McKinney. Or do you happily ignore that as a matter of "process"?

I thought is was bog-standard partisan chickenshit, which I believe is the 8th universal constant. If the shoe were on the other foot, I would have expected the same and now that the precedent has been well and truly set, we all know what the rules are. In the greater scheme of things, it's just one more example of the peeps with the stroke getting what they want. I wake up enough in the middle of the night worrying about screwing up a case to add worrying about political douche-baggery to the list of what keeps me up. My only beef with douche-baggery is, if you're going to complain about it, make sure your side isn't doing the same thing.

and he's gonna be the next attorney general.

And very likely the next SCOTUS Associate Justice.

One day, perhaps you can unpack that for us.

Yeah, maybe. We'll see.

[sapient]

I will be happy with functioning government, working for the people. I certainly have my preferences with regard to policy, but getting up in the morning knowing that my government isn't actively trying to screw its citizens over will give me a lot of comfort.

[McKinneyTexas]

At the same time, I think there are various types of cancel culture, left and right, if that is what you are referring to.

No, but I can see where you'd draw this inference. It's on the personal, social level where I'm concerned things could change. I'll leave it at that for the time being.

[wj]

and he's [Garland] gonna be the next attorney general.

And very likely the next SCOTUS Associate Justice.

Almost certainly not. Obama nominated him in the hopes that he was moderate enough to get confirmed. But at this point, I'd expect Biden to go for someone substantially younger.

[cleek]

Trump is standing in front of the DC rally right now, telling the [armed and insane] crowd that the Democrats are "illegal" and are "illegally taking charge" and that "we can't let it happen".

https://www.c-span.org/video/?507744-1/rally-electoral-college-vote-certification&live

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

Yes, and now the Secret Service and other federal law enforcement are protecting a fascist insurrectionist and his thugs demonstrating, perhaps violently against their own fucking government and (d)emocratic governance via the rule of law and the will of the people.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-urges-coup-crowd-to-head-to-capitol-to-harass-legislators-suggests-he-might-join

Think about that.

Rubicons .... crossed.

Could we see armed combat between the Secret Service and DC's National Guard?

Bring on whatever they've got.

[McKinneyTexas]

Trump is standing in front of the DC rally right now, telling the [armed and insane] crowd that the Democrats are "illegal" and are "illegally taking charge" and that "we can't let it happen".

In October, I would have said to myself, "Cleek needs to get a life." For that, I apologize. I can't believe what I am seeing and hearing from people. I can't believe his words aren't driving people away in droves.

[McKinneyTexas]

Could we see armed combat between the Secret Service and DC's National Guard?

Bring on whatever they've got.

Actually, this is exactly the kind of language that is now being mainstreamed and I don't much care for that.

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

"I can't believe what I am seeing and hearing from people. I can't believe his words aren't driving people away in droves."

Well, various commies, wokesters, Pinko's, and watchamacallits on political blogs that shall remain anonymous have been repeating ad nauseum "Believe!" for years now.

Good on, cleek.

[wj]

Just came across this fun factoid about Trump's call to Raffensperger. Apparently his incompetence is such that he was dialing the press office, where interns answered and hung up, assuming that it was a prank. Oops! How like him and his whole administration.

[cleek]

In October, I would have said to myself, "Cleek needs to get a life." For that, I apologize.

appreciated. but really, October Trump was still facing some competition for Worst President Ever. i don't think anyone could have guessed how far he would descend in these past two months.

i'm honestly amazed how much the various governmental systems have held up under the stress he and his cult have been putting on them lately.

[cleek]

and, McTx - i know we butt heads here and it sometimes gets heated... but, i imagine the political landscape must be a pretty horrific sight from where you stand right now. you have my sympathy.

[cleek]

WaPo's Latest Devlopments on the rally:

• Hundreds of Trump supporters stormed through metal barricades at the back of the Capitol building about 1 p.m. Wednesday, running past security guards and breaking fences.

• Capitol Police ordered evacuations of two Capitol campus buildings — the Library of Congress James Madison Memorial Building and the Cannon House Office Building, both just across Independence Avenue from the Capitol.

• Donald Trump Jr. and Eric Trump called on members of Congress to reject electoral votes Wednesday that would cement their father’s loss. “This isn’t their Republican Party anymore,” Trump Jr. said of GOP lawmakers who oppose rejecting the votes. “This is Donald Trump‘s Republican Party.” Their father then took the stage to claim he won the election.

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

"I can't believe what I am seeing and hearing from people. I can't believe his words aren't driving people away in droves."

The Republican Party ... the conservative movement ... has been increasingly accepting of mainstreaming this brand of rhetoric for a long damned time and electing officeholders who nod and wink at the threats.

Have you been listening to NRA rhetoric, to cite one example, for the past twenty years? They have been grooming for the kill since Gingrich came on the scene.

Where do we think Trump learned it. And he is just the apotheosis to apply it, which is why he so thrilling to behold by the filth now threatening governance and the country.

Now, we're here. Today.

I merely answer in kind.

It's exactly like someone breaking into your house with a weapon.

You answer in kind, as unacceptable as that may be.

Maybe it will burn itself out, just as the Symbionese Liberation Army's rhetoric and tactics back in the old days never claimed much purchase, if any, in the mainstream Democratic Party.

But the SLA never had 75 million (dry kindling ready, indeed eager, to ignite) groomed psychotics rooting them on.

I can't believe it either.

But I'm maintaining my "You ain't seen nothin' yet" stance for the foreseeable future.

[hairshirthedonist]

If you think back on what gets me going, it isn't personalities per se(DT being a major exception), but rather issues/policies/etc.

I'm just not getting the distinction you're making between your list of Republicans who have so much to answer for, on one hand, and McConnell on the other, regardless of how worked up you are or for what reasons. What makes him less odious than Cruz and company? What do you think they did that was so much more awful than the things McConnell's done?

Or what makes you thing public sentiment is significantly different as concerns McConnell as compared to your list of awful Republicans?

I'm not trying to change your mind. I'm just trying to figure out what you're getting at.

[cleek]

i think McConnell's a snake.

but even snakes know which way the wind is blowing.

[wj]

even snakes know which way the wind is blowing

And he may be seriously pissed off at Trump for losing him his Majority Leader position. That may or not be justified (i.e. Trump and his behavior may not have been decisive in Georgia). But I can see McConnell seeing it that way.

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

Pence, the lame prong rat:

"It is my considered judgement that my oath to support and defend the Constitution constrains me from claiming unilateral authority to determine which electoral votes should be counted and which should not,” Pence said in a statement released shortly before the session."

His wife four years ago:

"You got what you wanted, Mike. Now, stay away from me."

That's Pence to Trumps' left, the soporific moron fake Christian tool of Evil:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIe_ndiijNI

F*ck him.

[Girl from the North Country]

Yeah, I just saw that scoundrel trying to wrap the tattered cloak of patriotism and principle around himself. Too fucking late, Matey. Everybody has seen you for what you truly are: you enabled that crook and charlatan until one minute to midnight, a midnight conversion will not save your reputation now.

[Tony P.]

I sympathize with McKinney and respect his reticence about "actively rethinking our plans". But it would be irresponsible not to speculate after a tease like that:)

I therefore speculate that McKinney and his wife have been in a pickle since before the election. Life would become less comfortable for them if He, Trump lost. Also if He won.

That's my speculation because I can imagine that when your inclination is to tell "both sides" they're wrong, you leave yourself with few allies in a polarized world.

Gotta go. Trying to follow developments on the MAGAt assault on the Capitol.

--TP

[McKinneyTexas]

I'm not trying to change your mind. I'm just trying to figure out what you're getting at.

Fair point. Ok, maybe I just don't get out enough. My sense is that most of the commentariat here follows politics very closely. At that level, the distinction between McConnell and Cruz may be nonexistent.

I'm less engaged, first because I'm busy as shit practicing law (but, on a happier note, this really is my last full year) and second because I'm not interested enough in how the sausage gets made to stay focused. As a result, what hits my radar screen is Cruz/Graham/Gingrich, who have a much higher signature in the I-fellate-Donald Trump-every-chance-I-get range on my current events radar. McConnell strikes me as a guy that has to play the game to keep all of his assholes in line, and while I don't respect that at all (I'm with Mitt and Ben, remember?), what one does enthusiastically versus what one does to get the job done are material distinctions in my view.

Does this help?

I will address Cleek and Thullen in a bit. I have to finish some legal stuff.

[cleek]

“Lock all doors if able...immediately seek shelter...remain quiet and await further direction,” a voice said over the Capitol loud speaker

[Girl from the North Country]

My 02.16 of course relates to McConnell's road to Damascus in the senate.

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

"you leave yourself with few allies in a polarized world."

As someone with few allies (I'm bipolar; I melt at both ends), I hereby declare McKinney has allies here.

[hairshirthedonist]

Does this help?

It does. Thank you. I think I might even kinda-sorta agree with you on some level, though I tend to think just as many people hate McConnell's fish-eating guts as hate the fish-eating guts of the rest of them. That's just an impression, of course.

[hairshirthedonist]

One thing I could add is that I don't recall the sort of criticism of tRump coming from McConnell that once came from Cruz and Graham, so not so much whiplash (if my recollection is correct).

[Girl from the North Country]

Meanwhile, the Capitol explodes (not literally). CNN says texts from congresspeople, senators etc are saying they are being told to shelter...

[Girl from the North Country]

Pence "either has been or is about to be evacuated"

[cleek]

they're in the Capitol building. they've brought Confederate flags.

https://twitter.com/igorbobic/status/1346902299466203145/photo/1

[wj]

Well, it does make it clear where they're coming from. And what response is appropriate. We beat them once; we can do it again.

And then, perhaps, a new Reconstruction.

[Tony P.]

Even the most determined Both-Sides-ists now have to pick a side. My heart bleeds for them.

--TP

[Girl from the North Country]

Well, it was interesting a few days ago to see Marty referring to Trump's "dementia" (and remember, Marty said some months ago that Trump's challenge to norms was nothing particularly extreme). I'm guessing that's going to be the excuse for his recent behaviour from some of those bothsidesers.

(Not that I don't think, and haven't thought for a while, that Trump is cognitively challenged compared to Trump 10-15 years ago. But nothing he's been doing since the election makes me think it's his cognitive decline in operation; it's his narcissism and psychological syndrome about "losers" etc.)

[wj]

And now we are getting reports of "guns drawn" in the Capitol. And not by the Capitol Police. Good luck with "both sides do it" on that.

[Girl from the North Country]

Apparently Fox is reporting that shots have been fired and people are hurt.

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

Cops are injured. Not yet defunded.

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2021/1/6/2006376/-Violence-from-Trump-supporters-growing-worse-multiple-police-injuries-Capitol-Building-invadded

None of the violent demonstrators have been gunned down yet, even in the back. They aren't niggers so they don't qualify for conservative justice, not that those people are being left out of the coup e'tat:

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2021/1/6/2006319/-Bill-Barr-s-parting-gift-A-new-rule-stripping-civil-rights-enforcement-in-Justice-Department

Remember, Donald Trump, the fucking subhuman Republican conservative President of the United States, not one hour ago, sent those violent provocateurs to the Capitol to kill liberals, which apparently now include McConnell, Pence, Robespierre, Maria Callander, and Francis the Talking Mule.

Dreher is mumbling over his rosary regarding the fact that his life might be saved by a fag who feels sorry for his dwindling book sales, as the rabble the former raised get a load of his elitist tut-tutting of hard totalitarianism in the supperating flesh.

Spend those tax cuts while you got em, motherfuckers.

Remember. Do not forget what we have witnessed today.

Market was up 600 points not an hour ago, as it contemplated communism and mandatory buggering under and by the two new Georgia Senators.

Capitalists stormed Congress and the market then swooned. Hard to tell its allegiances.

Kudlow will be along soon to explain prior to his turn on the gallows, the lying prat.

[McKinneyTexas]

and, McTx - i know we butt heads here and it sometimes gets heated... but, i imagine the political landscape must be a pretty horrific sight from where you stand right now. you have my sympathy.

Thanks and appreciated. We will continue to clash. I hope we can all work on tone going forward, but never any need to pull punches on substance.

I sympathize with McKinney and respect his reticence about "actively rethinking our plans". But it would be irresponsible not to speculate after a tease like that:)

Not intended as a tease, but I can see why it came across that way. This post-election thing is beyond upsetting and I have no plans to hold back my thoughts on the Trump Crew. How that will play out remains to be seen.

Going forward, he should be called Adolf Trump.

Have you been listening to NRA rhetoric, to cite one example, for the past twenty years? They have been grooming for the kill since Gingrich came on the scene.

No, I have never paid any attention to the NRA. I have always sensed extremist rhetoric from the farther ends of both spectrums. Frankly, I always expected the explosion to come from the left. If this doesn't die down soon, Houston may have to secede. You wouldn't believe how calm everything seems to be here.

Ok, like five seconds ago, one of my law partners texted me. Go to this link: https://www.nationalreview.com/news/hill-staffers-evacuate-as-trump-supporters-clash-with-police-outside-capitol-building/

Jesus.

[cleek]

watch the lone Capitol officer try to handle the Republicans as they break in.

https://twitter.com/igorbobic/status/1346911809274478594

[McKinneyTexas]

Just saw this:

Romney tells Republican colleagues 'this is what you've gotten' as Senate shelters in breached Capitol
3:16 p.m.
Sen. Mitt Romney (R-Utah) put the blame for the chaos unfolding in the Capitol on Wednesday firmly on the shoulders of his Republican colleagues: "This is what you've gotten, guys," Romney was heard yelling as "mayhem unfolded in the Senate chamber, apparently addressing his colleagues who were leading the charge to press Mr. Trump's false claims of a stolen election," The New York Times reports.

Thank you, Mitt Romney.

[nooneithinkisinmytree]

Capitol Hill cops in hand to hand fist fights with subhumans.

[Girl from the North Country]

The fact that McKinney always thought "the explosion" would come from the left, shows how successful the rightwing noise machine has been. We saw Marty saying much the same about some of the BLM etc protests in Portland. And both McKinney and Marty said they despised Trump from the beginning. I would suggest that none of the lefties here are really all that surprised by what is happening; I would further suggest we have seen the MAGAts being capable of this for a long time.

[cleek]

at least one person has been shot inside the Capitol.

tear gas has been released in the Senate chamber.

the Q gang is sure this is all antifa in disguise.

Fuck The GOP.

[wj]

I would suggest that none of the lefties here are really all that surprised by what is happening

This non-lefty isn't surprised either. Since it's what Trump has been calling for for weeks. Horrified, shocked, and appalled. But not surprised.

[CharlesWT]

Apparently Fox is reporting that shots have been fired and people are hurt.

I can fondly remember when the most dangerous place in the Capitol was between Chuck Schumer and a TV camera...

[CharlesWT]

Going forward, he should be called Adolf Trump.

Trump is not a dictator. He just plays one on TV...

[Girl from the North Country]

And even long before the election, his behaviour at his rallies, encouraging violence "Beat the crap out of him!" etc, has shown from the very beginning exactly what he is, and exactly what they loved about him.

[cleek]

Trump is not a dictator.

nobody should doubt that he would take the job if it was in his reach. he has absolutely no use for restraints on what he wants to do, never has.

[McKinneyTexas]

The fact that McKinney always thought "the explosion" would come from the left, shows how successful the rightwing noise machine has been. We saw Marty saying much the same about some of the BLM etc protests in Portland.

This is probably not the time for batting this one back and forth--I started it--but the left has its own issues and always has. I haven't watched Fox in forever and my only conservative read is National Review, so whatever my faults may be, it isn't influence by the right-wing noise machine, whatever that is. Not saying it isn't a thing--obviously there are people in DC acting out big time--but it has never been on my radar. I'm more likely to read Jacobin or the Guardian or American Prospect.

[McKinneyTexas]

Ok, back to the issue at hand: how do we even begin to settle this dust? If the Repubs can't eat crow and admit it was wrong to follow DT (as step one), what next?

[wj]

So far, McCarthy is denouncing the invasion of the Capitol, while insisting that it isn't Trump's fault. Which, without question, it is.

[sapient]

Ok, back to the issue at hand: how do we even begin to settle this dust? If the Repubs can't eat crow and admit it was wrong to follow DT (as step one), what next?

As a Democrat who looks forward to at least two years of holding two of the three branches of government, I'm hoping to just do whatever we can for the people, advertise our successes, and hope that these traitors are exposed for the horror story that they are. In addition, the Justice Department has to prosecute crimes that were committed, especially the easier wins.

[CharlesWT]

Appears the TV networks are getting content to replace the reality TV episodes they couldn't make due to the pandemic. Politics as bloodsport entertainment...

[cleek]

IMO, until the GOP base can break out of its ever-widening spiral of conspiracy theories, the dust is just going to keep getting thicker.

the longer they stay closed-off from the reality that rest of the country lives in, the harder it's going to be to find ways to agree on even basic things (and forget about the hard stuff). and the more the left is going to polarize in response.

(yes, there are conspiracy theorists on the left, but they don't have much if any power. they certainly don't control the party.)

[Girl from the North Country]

What cleek said, especially his first para.

[hairshirthedonist]

WCS. These people (or at least a good number of them) actually believe they are fighting for democracy. It's insane.

[CharlesWT]

One rioter, sitting in Mike Pence's seat in the Senate chamber, declared Trump the winner of the election.

[McKinneyTexas]

nobody should doubt that he would take the job if it was in his reach. he has absolutely no use for restraints on what he wants to do, never has.

Yes, that started to become clear when, a few weeks after the election, he didn't just shut up and go sulk. Instead, he's continued to do whatever it might take--no limits at all, truly "whatever"--to hold office. Foolishly, I thought he'd eventually give up. Missed that one by miles.

Some comfort: GA can and should prosecute him for soliciting ballot box-stuffing. Convict his sorry ass and let him spend 3-5 years making new friends.