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February 18, 2017

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Count, just clean your cookies and you're good to go again with the NYT and WaPo. (though I have to say they're doing such good work at the moment for the first time in years that they might be worthy of support. I have subscribed to the New Yorker recently, because their coverage is extremely good and thoughtful and it's dirt cheap).

For some people Trump will actually have to shoot somebody on 5th Avenue until they admit that this is a catastrophe - these people seem to be of a very tolerant and forgiving nature, which is generally speaking admirable - the trouble is they don't seem to have any values at all.

Or just open a private browsing window on whatever browser you use. You'll have to paste the URL in, is all.

Breitbart digs deep and hits bottom:

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/simon-schuster-cancels-book-deal-with-breitbarts-milo-yiannopoulos-2017-02-20?siteid=bigcharts&dist=bigcharts

The digging will resume in a few days, because with those ilk, every bottom is a false bottom.

Nice work, GFTNC. Thanks.

Agree. But did you notice that article had not ONE fact in it? NOT ONE!!!!!!!!!!

/snark.

You know what got Watergate off the ground? A couple of young reporters bamboozling their editor with "anonymous sources"....AND THIS WENT ON FOR MONTHS!!!

NO FACTS.....(other than a penny ante break-in).

You don't believe it? Look it up!

And Marty, Trump is currently in egregious violation of the lease with the GSA for Tramp Acres in D.C.

But I understand that my usual blend of British sarcasm, provocation and gallows humor might have come across as flippancy, a lack of care for other victims or, worse, “advocacy.”

Oh Milo, nice try, but even to the British it was unmistakeable that you were *actually* displaying flippancy, a lack of care for other victims (understatement of the year) or, (much) worse, "advocacy".

the fact that he doesn't have all the government filled in is as much due to the Democrats obstruction of his appointments as any incompetence on his part.

As wj pointed out, this is not even remotely true. Many of the assistant secretaries, etc., have not even been named or appointed....so how did the Dems "obstruct" that? Amazing stuff if true, but if they had those kinds of powers, they certainly would not have lost the election. Would you not agree?


Yes, I realize that we shouldn't judge these figures by the standards of our enlightened times, ...

Not only being products of their times, they were also bound by the social and legal expectations of their times.

At the time the Declaration of Independence was written, 86 landholders owned about two-thirds of the state of Virginia. The law required that eldest sons were first in line to inherit and holdings couldn't be broken up into smaller partials.

As to freeing slaves, what prevented freed slaves being treated as unclaimed/abandoned property to be kidnapped back into slavery?

just clean your cookies and you're good to go again with the NYT and WaPo

With WaPo lately, I sometimes find I have to clear my browser history as well. Inconvenient, but it does the trick.

this is not even remotely true. Many of the assistant secretaries, etc., have not even been named or appointed

As I dig a little deeper, it seems that part of the problem is this. In past administrations, the assistant secretaries, etc. from the previous administration stayed around until their successors were approved. And then a little longer, to help get them up to speed. That way, the work kept getting done while the changeover happened.

But this time around, all those assistant secretaries, etc. were told that their services were no longer required. Before anyone was in place (or, often, even nominated) to replace them. So what we have is gaping holes in the management structure, and nobody there to train the new guys, even once they arrive.

And by the way, is there still nobody in post for the chief information security officer for the White House's Executive Office of the President ? Quite an oversight.....

http://www.zdnet.com/article/white-house-chief-information-security-officer-departs/

Not where I originally saw it, but same story.

GftNC, not to worry, Rudy's taking care of the cyber. Maybe he'll get Bernie Kerik to help.

Isn't being nagged by some Obama administration holdover about how tweeting from your favorite Samsung phone is "insecure" pretty much in the same category as other "fake news"? Just stuff that you don't want to hear and don't want to be true. So why not get rid of the irritating little git?

GFTNC, have you finished reading the Medium piece on 4chan you linked the other day?

It seems the "We can say whatever we want" thing isn't working out for Milo, well beyond the CPAC disinvitation.

As cleek points out, it has worked out very well for trump:

http://ok-cleek.com/blogs/?p=25467

Oh, I see the Count beat me to it. I thought his link was just about the canceled book deal, not his Breitbart departure. But, hey, good news is worth reading about twice, right?

Jesus Christ, ral, I thought you were joking! But when I looked it up, there it was in black and white, albeit " informal cybersecurity adviser". Going for serious expertise in this important matter I see.

hsh, yes I finished it. Well, as Obama apparently told Trump, reality has a way of asserting itself. Just not quickly enough, I'd say.

...just clean your cookies and you're good to go again with the NYT and WaPo.

how do you do that? if it doesn't appear on a drop down menu, I tend to start drinking and cursing.

Private browsing window, dammit! You don't need to clear anything.

As to freeing slaves, what prevented freed slaves being treated as unclaimed/abandoned property to be kidnapped back into slavery?

Laws.

In Virginia, the mechanics of manumission required that it be done by deed or will, and those instruments would have been recorded in the courthouse. After 1806, anyone emancipated by their owner was required to leave the state, unless they had permission to stay, or they could be reenslaved. People who had been enslaved who were allowed to be in the state had to register.

Some interesting history is here.

how do you do that?

If you use Firefox:
Click on the 3 bars at the upper right for the menu and select "Options".
From the list on the left, click on "Privacy".
On the right, about 2/3 of the way down, click on "Show Cookies".
You can either highlight them one by one and remove, or click the "Remove All" button.

If you use Chrome:
In the upper right, click on the 3 little (vertical) dots.
Select "Settings" from the drop-down list.
At the bottom, click on "Show Advanced Settings".
Under Privacy, click on "Clear Browser Data".
In the pop-up window, check the boxes for Cookies.
Click on "Clear Browser Data"

If you use Internet Explorer. Don't.

Hope that helps.

sapient! O happy day!

How many US citizens are going to be deported under Trump's new immigration policies? How many is "ok" if you support the new policies?

sapient, thanks for the link.

Though I suspect more than a few free persons were illegally kidnapped into slavery.

In passing, the first self made woman millionaire was the daughter of slaves.

Thanks, GftNC. Feel refreshed and calm because of my vacay.

Though I suspect more than a few free persons were illegally kidnapped into slavery.

Yes, in fact there were some cases about that. More later.

This might be a little over the line but...

http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a53300/milo-bill-tennessee/

trump's Soviet 5-year plan

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/trumps-plan-to-declare-victory-on-the-economy-194250110.html

Republicans are lying filth.

Something other than Trump: clever measurement of the Hubble constant via gravitational lensing H0LiCOW

There's a video. Enjoy.

Regarding slavery, since it is Black History Month, a lot of heartbreaking stuff is in this old book, A Practical Treatise on the Law of Slavery, by Jacob D. Wheeler, Esq., copyright 1837, a handbook for lawyers who needed to handle such cases.

The next time I hear someone say that we need to quit thinking about "identity politics", which I heard recently at a meeting of "progressives" in my town, I'm going to think about this treatise.

I'm also going to think about the Jewish cemeteries.

I'm also going to think about the defunding of Planned Parenthood.

I'm also going to think about the ethnic cleansing that is being planned by Trump's DHS, as exhibited by today's deportation rules. Deportation from "the Homeland".

I promised LJ that I would practice anger management, so I'm done for now, maybe going to look at the greater Universe.

The book I cited before, the handbook for lawyers handling slave cases, contains very old case law. If you take a look, you should know that during the 19th century, there was a lot of prefatory material before a reader could discern what the case actually held.

When I have some time, maybe I'll make a project of summarizing the cases in this old book. It's an eye-opening view into what life was like in those good-ole-days.

I'm 60. My great grandparents were born before the Civil War, when this book would have been handy. I didn't know my great-grandparents, but lots of people now do. This is not ancient history.

Most people here probably know this. I know this. But it seems awfully immediate right now.

Also in other news, last Friday marked the passing of the great Clyde Stubblefield, one of the drummers in James Brown's first great band.

Stubblefield is the drummer on Brown's "The Funky Drummer", one of the two most widely sampled drum breaks ever (the other being The Winston's "Amen Brother"). It's fair to say that he was one of the inventors of funk as an American musical style.

He was a very well loved cat. RIP Mr Stubblefield.

The Funky Drummer, Clyde's break starts about 5:20.

"Tronald Dump is a shining wit," the Reverend Spooner might have stammered after watching He, Trump's infamous press conference.

Despite his professed distaste for that vulgar charlatan, our friend Marty seems determined to rationalize He, Trump's whining. I can only imagine what Marty would be saying if he had actually voted for Him.

Until Rush Limbaugh reports that he has seen hi-def video on Breitbart showing Putin handing He, Trump a briefcase full of neatly banded hundred-dollar bills with non-consecutive serial numbers, there will be people denouncing The Left and The Press for having "fact-free" suspicions about the Tribune of the White Working Class. And maybe not even then.

It's time to consider a two-state solution. Not for the Middle East. For the bit of North America that lies between Mexico and Canada -- one land inhabited by two distinct populations.

A key ingredient of constitutional democracy is protection of the minority from a tyranny of the majority. That's what allows distinct populations to live, peacefully intermingled, under a single national government. The constitution of the US is explicitly designed to permit a tyranny by the minority. "Permit" does not mean "require", but the minority has been awfully uppity this millennium. That's a recipe for trouble.

--TP

The whole immigration thing is getting particularly high profile around here. Simply because the crops are planted, and if the (mostly illegal) immigrant farm workers aren't available, a lot of farmers are looking at big losses when the crops don't get harvested.

But I see that there are other places that there can be an impact. Consider how many Latin American baseball players there are in the majors. If the administration is, as rumor has it, going to sometimes ignore green cards when deporting people . . . well, I guess there will be increased opportunities for American ball players.

And, it turns out, there are some major league players who don't even have green cards. Even when they have been playing here for years.
http://www.eastbaytimes.com/2017/02/21/as-aussie-immigrant-on-trumps-plan-scary-from-any-point-of-view/
(Of course, being Australian rather than Hispanic, he is unlikely to get carded. Or was, until this hit the papers.)

Has anyone seen the Count in the same room with an Iowa pig farmer?

Peterson told Grassley on Tuesday, “Over 20 million will lose coverage. And with all due respect, sir, you’re the man that talked about the death panels. We’re going to create one great big death panel in this country [because of the fact] that people can’t afford to get insurance.”

With reference to the new slogan under the Washington Post's masthead:

Democracy Dies in Darkness

I couldn't help thinking about this, which I read in Alan Bennett's latest volume of diaries. It is irresistibly reminiscent of the kind of Republican sloganeering which, more than ironically, makes such an absurd fetish of the word "freedom". It's Tennyson on the French Revolution:

Freedom, free to slay herself, and dying while they shout her name.

To quote the late American poet William Matthews, who was quoting Dante:

And I have told you this to make you grieve.

Democracy Dies in Darkness

Slogan or headline?

"Slogan or headline?"

Ideological goal.

HSH, I particularly liked the Trump tweet included in your link. I can't quite put my finger on it, but it had a familiar, comforting sound to it...

I particularly liked the Trump tweet included in your link

At least he's backed off from the "They're all paid!" BS.

You're such a good boy, you're doing such a good job. Mommy and Joe Scar love you very much. You are phenomenal, the best!

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/trump-twitter-staffer-235263

Neatly making my point for me, the current main headline in the Huffington Post:

Ryan's Word for Gutting Healthcare: Freedom!

(meanwhile, she lies dying while they call her name)

It seems that Ryan is a little vague on the principle that:
"Your freedom to wave your hand around ends at my nose."

Of course, that view is also anathema to anyone in the NRA.

Ryan's Word for Gutting Healthcare: Freedom!

Enjoy every minute of your freedom to wait in the ER.

The chairs are not too uncomfortable, and there's always Fox on the TV. If you're actually dying, you may even go to the head of the line.

The thing that makes me actually want to kick Ryan in the nuts is the fact that he got SS survivor benefits when his old man died.

Fine for him, the rest of you can go piss up a rope.

The road to hell is paved with copies of "The Fountainhead".

Where am I and what am I doing in this hand basket?

Uh oh. Not Dante again.

"I have a beautiful little Smith & Wesson, 9 millimeter, and it goes with me virtually everywhere. But I do believe in the right to carry, and I believe in the right to defend myself and my family—whether it’s from an intruder, or whether it’s from the government, should they decide that my rights are no longer important.”

Jodie Ernst, 2014, threatening second amendment solutions against government

Jodie Ernst, 2017, herself now gummint, the chickensh*t conservative c*nt (trumpers set the tone; I'm just memorizing the words), flees first amendment suggestions from those armed only with words:

https://boingboing.net/2017/02/22/chickenshit.html

We're hearing more of the old bullsh*t bout them "outside agitators" attending townhall meetings, as we did from Nixonian racist authoritarians and racist southern Democratic sheriffs and filth, soon after to become conservative Republican filth, during the 1950s, 1960s, and early 1970s.

Ya know, them outside darkies, like Martin Luther King and John Lewis.

Josh Chaffetz, self-appointed republican d*ck conservative bully, feels threatened and bullied. He's only had a taste of what's coming, as has Ernst.


From Joni Ernst's Statement on Pruitt Confirmation

In a private meeting and before the Environment and Public Works Committee, I received assurances from Mr. Pruitt that when it comes to the RFS, he will enforce the law as written by Congress, and not undermine the RFS. [italics mine]

From the Tiger and the Brahmin

"I give you assurances," cried the tiger. "I shan't eat you if you let me out of the cage. I shall repay your kindness with gratitude. I swear to Vishnu that I won't eat you."

This comes to mind whenever I hear about assurances.

Oh, I see I left out

[I]... question[ed] Mr. Pruitt over many issues of great importance to Iowans, including scrapping the Waters of the United States rule, promoting our state’s wind energy industry, and upholding the Renewable Fuel Standard (RFS) in accordance with congressional intent.

You get the idea I'm sure.

The idea being, we hate government regulations . . . except when we benefit from them. Likewise we dislike all that environmental nonsense . . . except the parts that directly benefit the Iowa economy.

Hardly surprising. The country is full of people with similar views. Especially when it comes to their MediCare.

I'm semi-surprised to hear somebody in IA complaining about the Waters of the US stuff. Most agricultural state folks I've seen quoted hate those regs.

Semi-surprised but also pleased, because in addition to wearing a man bag and tying my French scarf in a hacking knot, I also like to hug a tree now and then.

Like to drink water, too.

Drinking water is overrated

Depending on what it is polluted with, even high alcohol content may not save you. Just sayin'

Where I come from, we drink wooder.

Well, formally water is the most simple of alcohols: R-OH with R = H.

Exceptional:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/undocumented-woman-brain-tumor-removed-hospital-lawyer-article-1.2979956

Trump "alpha-male" adviser apparently just a sensitive little guy in need of a safe space. Sad!

http://www.newsweek.com/sebastian-gorka-white-house-terrorism-adviser-angry-call-559805

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/02/23/the-kremlin-and-gop-share-a-new-friend-and-boy-does-she-love-guns.html?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning

The NRA has its own Red Dawn.

Those paratroopers landing in your schoolyard sporting the Russian flag are actually Republicans.

RedState indeed.

I think it was Moe Lane and his future fellow Beavis and Butthead Redstaters back in the day at Tacitus and here who would reminisce about massaging their teenage boners over "Red Dawn", the movie.

They got off over the thought of grabbing a week's supply of Cheetos and heading for the hills with their automatic weapons.

The killing in this country should have started long ago.

It may be too late now.

It's a military operation now:

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/trump-says-deportation-enforcement-is-military-operation

Meanwhile, one state, there are others as well, moves to make protest illegal.

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/2/23/1636892/-Arizona-Republicans-have-a-plan-to-make-protest-illegal

Especially if you plan a peaceful protest and fascist FBI and conservative plants disrupt it with violence to make everyone look bad.

ryan and company have been turning away Americans bearing petitions using security teams.

trump and republican security forces are definitely being guided and trained in Russian totalitarian security measures to bring the boot down in America.

Go ahead, republican filth, shut down an armed population's peaceful avenues for petitioning their grievances before government.

Please do that.

My vote goes to Dragonite and Charizard...
http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/music_box/2017/02/could_yg_s_fdt_f_donald_trump_become_america_s_no_1_song.html

(Though I've been fond of Pokemon ever since my youngest leaned to read playing the game when it first came out.)

Count, you really need to see this:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/acts-of-faith/wp/2017/02/22/demonic-activity-palpable-at-president-trumps-rally-pastor-says/?utm_term=.9019d30a7220

And, perhaps surprisingly, he's not talking about anti-Trump protestors. He's talking about the idol worship he felt he was seeing.

Part of the problem with Obama's "look forward not back" approach to torture accountability, these people are not only still around but have been promoted:

https://twitter.com/ericgeller/status/834492970371911680

Part of the problem with Obama's "look forward not back" approach to torture accountability

The other part being that it was plain wrong.

Ugh and Nigel:

You're assuming that prosecution would have yielded conviction. A big if.

Ugh, your Newsweek link on Gorka gave me a great deal of pleasure. I think part of my obsession with him (apart from the fact that a young twit I've known from babyhood keeps retweeting him approvingly) is that superficially he sounds richly British and respectable, and ridiculous though it is this may give him some credibility with the viewing public. Whereas to an English person, he immediately sounds very dodgy indeed, more oleaginous Toby Esterhazy than anything else (for fans of the Alec Guinness Tinker Tailor).

Count, your Daily Kos link on the attempts to make protesting impossible or at least more difficult is very chilling. I've been fearing something like this since the Women's March. Here's hoping the courts hold the line.

Very annoyingly, it's now my turn not to be able to read a link - wj's WaPo piece on the demonic activity at Trump's rally. I long for it, but I've now used up my monthly allowance (the NYT is the only subscription I've got at the moment, but I may have to get WaPo and the New Yorker if things go on like this). I tried deleting all records of WaPo articles this month from my browsing history, but it didn't work. I'll survive - I don't think it's worth someone cutting and pasting like I did with the NYT article, if it's any great length, so I will take pleasure in what I imagine it says!

Very annoyingly, it's now my turn not to be able to read a link - wj's WaPo piece on the demonic activity at Trump's rally.

GFTNC, did you try opening a private browsing window and pasting the URL in? That always works for me with WaPo articles on my iPad. Every browser I've used has private browsing as an option.

hsh: ok, this is where it becomes clear (if it isn't already) just how ignorant I am about computer-related matters. I barely knew what you were talking about, or how to do it. But guess what, I mucked about for a bit, and hallelujah - it worked! On Chrome it seems to be called an Incognito Window. Thank you very much.

Ah, yes. The guy with the sunglasses, right? Glad it worked for you.

That's the one.

This is from Feb 6th, so it's possible someone (maybe even me - I'm seeing so much it's all one big jumble in my mind) has already posted it, in which case as usual I apologise. It's an interesting and quite helpful piece by David Frum on how the left can make their protests really achieve something apart from catharsis. I'm well aware how weird it is to be taking advice from the man who, apart from anything else, coined "the Axis of Evil" (although if we didn't have that we wouldn't have Axis of Weasels, so there's no cloud without a silver lining). But, in the spirit with which McK answered Doc Science's request for thoughts on how to gather Republican or conservative allies, this is useful, and a lot of it is not all that different from Indivisible's advice anyway.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/how-to-beat-trump/515736/

"frum" means devout or pious in Yiddish.

Picked that up in the Saul Bellow biography I'm reading.

Yes, hence colloquial (non-orthodox) usage to describe ultra (or even semi-ultra) orthodox types as "frumniks". There's a lot to be said for Yiddish, it is tremendously expressive. When someone is feeling all mixed up and confused, they say they are "tsu-misht". It says it all, really.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/artemenko-ukrainian-lawmaker-michael-cohen-treason-probe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_gas_in_Ukraine

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/18/world/europe/in-taking-crimea-putin-gains-a-sea-of-fuel-reserves.html?_r=0

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/1/25/1625039/-Does-Donald-Trump-Now-Hold-a-Significant-Stake-in-Rosneft

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/cnn-fbi-rejected-white-house-request-refute-russia-report

Oy Vey!

Maybe we should speak Yiddish around here from now on, because obviously plain English ain't doing us any good.

We'll let Marty have sole use of the word "bupkes!"

But, in the spirit with which McK answered Doc Science's request for thoughts on how to gather Republican or conservative allies, this is useful, and a lot of it is not all that different from Indivisible's advice anyway.

Maybe I didn't read McKinney right. But if McKinney is still holding out for someone to "convince" him of stuff, perhaps McKinney should read Frum.

I've been following Frum on Twitter, and pushing a lot of "likes". Like McMullen (whose domestic policies I totally disagree with), he's a patriot. I completely disagree with a lot of stuff that neoconservative people have said and defended, but Trump's people want to burn it down.

As far as I remember, it was a lot of work getting from the laws that I posted last night, to the Civil War, to reconstruction, to Jim Crow, to Civil Rights, to expanding Civil Rights ... to where most of us were reasonably comfortable, where we were opening our hearts to people we were suspicious of .... It was incremental. It was two steps forward, and often more than one step back.

McKinney is an advocate. He doesn't need for us to persuade him - he's fully capable of getting on the train. If he's with us, he needs to be persuading people - not asking us for reasons. He should be providing them.

Again, I promised LJ that I would not be an angry participant. And I am not trolling - I'm just asking that people look at the world, and figure out what to do for our children. I've agreed with McKinney before, and am more than willing to extend my hand again.

sapient - there are other ways of holding people accountable than prosecuting them. E.g., why is that person (along with others) still working for the CIA? He could have declassed the Senate torture report in full. He could have stop invoking the state secrets doctrine. Etc.

None of them require a conviction in front of a jury.

When Trump installs his cronies in the NSA, it would be a good idea to post all of your comments in Yiddish, for security.

Pig-latin is also an option.

But personally I prefer the somewhat more rigorous ROT-13 encoding.

For extra security, use DOUBLE ROT-13.

Fakakta Schvantzes

https://www.balloon-juice.com/2017/02/23/open-thread-gop-attempting-to-buff-away-the-kgb-fingerprints/

Republicans and Trump: Precisely the same.

why is that person (along with others) still working for the CIA? He could have declassed the Senate torture report in full.

No, he couldn't have, without making it a vigilante prosecution.

Sapient, read the first page of the doc's recent post "the United States has no National Security". You don't have to go far down, only the first ten or fifteen comments or so, to see the exchange between McKinney and her - I think you will see some surprising agreement, and frum-like advice, which she asks him for.

No, he couldn't have, without making it a vigilante prosecution.

What I mean is, the US government owns this. Scapegoating what quite obviously had the imprimatur of the "people", particularly after the 2004 elections, would be IMO pretty ugly. We voted for it (not me, but we). We voted for Trump (not me, but we).

This is what happens when we (not me) don't take elections deadly seriously. We (including me) suffer the shame.

Thanks GftNC. I was lurking, and saw it. I get it that McKinney is being more reasonable, and that's nice. Anger management.

Again, I extend my hand.

You mean make the CIA agent's targets? I guess. He could have done it in a way that covered that up (which would not be "in full"), but instead we don't only get the redacted executive summary.

State secrets could have been taken off the table. High (and low) level CIA folk involved could have been fired/ousted/encouraged to leave early.

He could have encouraged a full, fair, and public accounting of that period, but instead let CIA fight it tooth and nail.

Here we are nearly 15 years on, and we still don't know the full extent of the US government's use and promotion of torture. Instead, we're at risk of stepping back into that, secret prisons, and an expansion of Gitmo. CIA #2 is now someone who ran a black site prison in thailand and knee deep in torture.

Second in charge.

As I said elsewhere in reference to the US Army and Abu Ghraib, is the lesson learned on torture don't do it, or don't take pictures? It appears to be the latter.

sapient, I appreciate your control here. I'm not trying to tone police, and I don't have much time the next two months to wade into things, but wanted to make a few observations.

coming from the mindset 'I know what the world is like and you don't' is not going to get us far. It's not the anger that I have a problem with, it is the anger directed at people participating here.

I'm not suggesting that you or anyone else has crossed any lines and again, I am glad you are back. But I know that _I_ am yelling at the TV, and _my_ patience with everyday bumps and problems is vastly reduced. I think it is difficult if not impossible to reduce the amount of anger in me, but what I have to do is to make sure that I don't direct it at the wrong people. This might seem directed at you, but it is a more general plea that came to mind when you talked about anger. So please don't think I'm calling you out. thx

Anyway, a few more things
GftN might be interested in this
http://europe.newsweek.com/sebastian-gorka-white-house-terrorism-adviser-angry-call-559805?rm=eu

Another great (which is to say horrific) link
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/rumana-ahmed-trump/517521/

Again, thanks everyone, I appreciate you participation now more than ever.

LJ, just on a personal note: I was insulted at being banned, but then actually grateful for it. I think of you as being a compassionate intermediary, and when I speak of your intervention, and promise that I will observe my promise, I am not being snarky.

Anyway, I won't put it on you anymore. I'll just try to be mindful.

Again, thanks.

It appears that at least some Senate Republicans have utterly failed to learn from the experience of California Republicans:
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/the-coming-battle-over-legal-immigration/517518/

Prop 187 changed California from a state the elected Ronald Reagan as Governor twice, and that routinely (as in more often than not) had Republicans as Governor and in other statewide offices, to one where Republicans not only hold zero statewide offices, but are an utter irrelevance in the state legislature. And yet, here are Senators Cotton and Purdue, trying to drive the national party down the same path.

"Those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

What I mean is, the US government owns this.

You say this, but in your prior and next breath, you insist that the one thing owning this can't mean is that the US gov't (which is entirely comprised of officials both elected and unelected, with professional and legal responsibilities to uphold and obey the laws and Constitution) can be held accountable or face consequences for what they "own". Which... means "owning" it doesn't actually mean anything.

As I said elsewhere in reference to the US Army and Abu Ghraib, is the lesson learned on torture don't do it, or don't take pictures? It appears to be the latter.

This is the most important point. Refusing to even formally investigate specifically identified individuals who were responsible for numerous well-documented violations of law (even after receiving very lenient guidelines as to what was considered legal), as well as their admitted destruction of further documentation and lying to Congress about what their internal reviews concluded (among many, many things) sends a very, very clear message: do whatever you want, and we'll do everything in our power to look the other way; laws are for little unimportant people, and what you're doing is srs bzns.

The fact that we have elections doesn't - indeed, can't - mean those we elect (and their bureaucratic minions, accomplices, and instigators) have free reign to ignore our laws. Any claim that it can or should has no basis in the Constitution, and indeed runs squarely counter to it. Rule of law vs. rule of men, etc. The idea that we elect kings is... beyond noxious.

The idea that we elect kings is... beyond noxious.

It might be beyond noxious. But it definitely isn't beyond belief.

Indeed, an awful lot of people seem to have a strong desire for a king. Some strongman to take care of everything for them. Or, I suspect, to take responsibility for them.

McKinney: Doc, thanks for identifying the leading, IMO, argument for removing Trump from office via the 25th Amendment.

Doc Sci: I am heartened beyond words that this argument works for you, McKinney.

What do you think would be the best way to spread it to other not-Hillary voters?

McKinney: Good question. Of the cuff, widespread lobbying for a bipartisan select commission with full subpoena power (and power to grant immunity and power to hear classified material in camera) to look into Russian hacking the DNC, Russian contacts with the administration pre-inauguration, the administration's relationship with the intelligence community and the administration's husbandry (if I can use that word in a gender neutral sense) of classified information.

If it were me writing the script, the campaign for the foregoing would include being a lot more selective about other Trump-related issues--I'm not saying across the board silence, just be a lot more selective. If he's an asshole at a press conference, so what? That isn't jeopardizing national security.

If you want a coalition, build one.

OK. So we have McKinney, in agreement with most of us, thinking that the security stuff pretty much justifies invoking 25th Amendment. He then, when asked, proceeds to give almost identical advice to Frum on how to harness the power of the protests to achieve something solid. I hope we can agree, therefore, that at the moment people like McKinney are not our problem. Marty, on the other hand, while not drinking the Kool-Aid yet, seems to be in a strange state of denial. We'll have to see which way he jumps...

Monitoring the opinions of conservatives seems to me to be vital at the moment. As someone on another thread noted, we don't have to change the minds of liberals and progressives, we need to change the minds of reasonable conservatives and Republicans.


Only two quibbles with McTX's perfectly reasonable counsel:

Change "administration's husbandry" to "administration's animal husbandry".

..and

I agree with selectivity, soberly researched and firmly- and professionally-worded, at the levels at which the 25th Amendment will have to be invoked, channeled, and put into operation .. the legitimate 4th Estate and communications with elected representatives ... but at street level, by which I mean here and on the street, ya know, the fifth estate, pointing out "Geez, what an asshole!" after any one of his press conferences or any other utterance is perfectly fine form, and besides it's fun to observe his supporters yell, "Yes, exactly! He's just like us!"

Besides, I'm not sure that his bizzare behavior and words don't pose a threat to national security. I mean, if he threatens Iran, North Korea, Russia, or China with violence in a press conference, because a synapse misfires (under the normal rules of civil discourse, which we left behind somewhere about the time he held up his fingers in a Presidential primary debate to show he was bigger than Marco Rubio -- not an impossible claim .. but still) 30 seconds into a press conference, and any of those actors move military assets even an inch in response, yeah, then national security is on the f*cking line!

Aside from the 25th Amendment, and as most of you realize, I have bigger fish to fry.

Getting trump is all very well and necessary, but I want the republican party to come out of this a steaming pile of charred rubble. I want it dead, as in non-existent.

Frankly, I want it to be made illegal in the United States, as the Communist Party is, or was, on the books.

This has nothing to do with the issues. The republican party birthed donald trump/bannon and company after a multi-decade gestation period. trump is not their offspring, he's the malignant tumor that's been mestastisizing at the cellular level of that movement for half a century.

And that goes for the conservative movements across the globe, including Putin's.

This is not an endorsement of anything the Democratic Party stands for either. this is far and beyond whether I want universal healthcare or not.

I don't care what comes after the republican party's death.

I want personal vengeance against the entire republican conservative edifice.

Call me biased.

"Beautiful clean coal", intones He, Trump -- and some people still think He is not nuts.

The US is failing its Rorschach test.

--TP

To boil it down:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzX5cGKN6Eg

Ya know, back in the early 1980s, I worked in a small federal gummint office for awhile whose mission it was to try and jump start clean coal technologies and coal slurry pipelines through public/private partnerships.

Republicans nixed that.

It was too clean for them, I think.

This has nothing to do with the issues. The republican party birthed donald trump/bannon and company after a multi-decade gestation period. trump is not their offspring, he's the malignant tumor that's been mestastisizing at the cellular level of that movement for half a century.

Agreed, and as I have noted before, the sleep of reason brings forth monsters. Reason has been asleep, or comatose, while they a) deny climate change b) deny evolution and posit creationism and c) espouse discredited anti-vax theories, to name just three examples of anti-science idiocy. Oy vey indeed.

lj, I should have said, thanks for the Gorka link, which I listened to again with great enjoyment. His "lets do this like gentlemen" shtick particularly amuses me, since it is another naked bid to claim the "civilised English gentleman" mantle. Ha! Like the kids (used to?) say "As if!" Anyway, what I really wanted to say is that whatever will be keeping you busy for the next two months, I hope it's nothing too bad, and I, like sapient, send you good vibes and wish you nothing but the best.

GftNC, I think you are very unkind to Toby Esterhase. :-)

c) espouse discredited anti-vax theories

A quibble - this one isn't close to being a particularly right-wing phenomenon. Like the 9/11 truthers, anti-vaxxers come from both halves (maybe, more accurately, ends) of the spectrum.

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