I survived the blizzard of 2016...open thread!

by Ugh

And all I got was this lousy T-shirt, and snow shoveling back soreness, and 6 straight snow days for the elementary school student.  Whee!

In other news, best medical system in the world, baby!  Death panels!  This seems to kind of be a problem.  

If Trump wins the GOP nomination, does he pick Cruz as his Veep running mate?  I say yes, the ultimate f-you to everyone.  

On the permanent war front.  

On the bright side:  only 3 days until the Iowa Caucuses!  Open thread.

Comments

[JanieM]

In yet other news, more support for the "idea" that everyone will be safer when everyone has a gun.

[wj]

If Trump wins the GOP nomination, does he pick Cruz as his Veep running mate? I say yes, the ultimate f-you to everyone.

No way! He pick the real ultimate f-you to everyone: Sanders. Exploding heads everywhere. . . .

[Ugh]

An armed society is a terrified society.

[Ugh]

First the came for the silencers, and I did not speak out because I am not a silencer.

[Doctor Science]

We finally got our drive thoroughly shoveled on Weds., late afternoon. During the summer I really like my Subaru, but in the winter? LOVE. I have never loved a car the way I love this ♥car♥.

Our mailbox (and its post) is a casualty of the township snowplows, so I have to go to the post office every day or so for mail & packages.

Since the snow, our intermittent mouse problem has become a serious mouse problem. Mr Dr sets two traps every night, I carry out the corpses in the morning. When he sets more traps than that, the field of death is just too much for me to deal with before coffee.

When we were renovating this summer, the workers found a corn snake and evidence that it had been living in the walls for a while. I took it outside, but I really hope it moved back in, or will in the spring. Come home, corn snake, all is forgiven! The cat is more than 14 years old, and useless as a predator.

[Yama]

Stay on top of them mice, Doc. And watch out if they get into the cars - it can really get out of control.

Just for the Count:
https://popehat.com/2016/01/28/atlas-mugged/

[Countme-In]

I like that Yama. Thanks.

In this week's New Yorker, one of the cartoons depicts a farmer holding a hoe as he stands next to his corn field advising his young son about when the crop can be harvested.

Some of the corn stalks are reading Ayn Rand novels.

Caption: "The corn hasn't quite matured if it's still reading Ayn Rand."

[Nigel]

Either that, or it's the special variety with no taste at all ?

[Countme-In]

"First came the silencers"

Open-carry aficionados try to observe noise restrictions in your finer dining establishments. It's hard enough to hear conversation because of ambient noise without adding gunfire into the mix.

Movie theaters in Texas ask patrons to turn off their cell phones and screw the silencers onto their guns before the show starts.

Everyone complies, even the murderers. Rule of law.

With a silencer, a guy can accidentally discharge his firearm in church and shoot himself in a testicle without waking the parishioners who snooze, I mean, pray around him.

"Hey, bub, you're bleeding from the pantleg," someone will observe.

"It's nothing. Sympathetic stigmata. Say, can you tear out a couple of pages of that hymnbook and pass them over to me?"

[Countme-In]

With a silencer, a shooter can take out an entire math class in a high school without disturbing the study hall down the corridor.

[Countme-In]

"Either that, or it's the special variety with no taste at all?"

We call that pig corn in the heartland of the flyover country where I grew up.

[Countme-In]

Some eternal silence would be nice from this ilk:

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/1/29/1476914/-Cruz-happy-to-let-millions-lose-health-insurance-to-replace-Obamacare-with-Canadian-style-care

Christians may be right about one thing: Evil is a pre-existing condition.

[Nombrilisme Vide]

First the came for the silencers, and I did not speak out because I am not a silencer.

Well, in fairness, you wouldn't speak out if you were a silencer, either.

[Hartmut]

NV, or you would just repeat with the correct phase shift.

Hm, would firing two guns (same model) phase shifted be less loud than each individual gun?
Time for that double barreled synchronized AK-47 for the silent massacre.

Btw, they are not just coming for your guns but also your flamethrowers.
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/114/hr4009/text

[Snarki, child of Loki]

"he cat is more than 14 years old, and useless as a predator."

Cat *smell* can keep mice away. So (presuming the use of litterboxes), time the litterbox chores so that there's some "used litter waiting for disposal" near mouse entry-point, bagged but not sealed.

Snakes aren't that good for getting rid of mice either, slow metabolism means 1 mouse/month, probably less.

If you haven't already, Blizzak tires + Subaru = happy winter driver.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

Hartmut:

I don't see how they can ban flamethrowers! Surely they're protected by the 2nd Amendment, since that ensures our right to "firearms".

Difficult to conceal-carry, but that's a technical problem.

[wj]

But all you have to do is make the flame thrower look like a leaf-blower. The bloody things are everywhere. (And most people will stay too far away to look closely, just of avoid the horrid sound.)

[Hartmut]

Ah, that's the reason why leafblowers are banned on planes since 9/11. I always wondered.

[wj]

This year's important question about the Republican primaries: Which candidate is the actual incarnation of Jeremiah Scudder?

OK, Heinlein forecast him getting elected in 2012. But considering that he was writing in 1940, not too bad on the accuracy.

[Countme-In]

Final sentence in the wiki plot summary:

"They find that he (Prophet Scudder) has been killed by his own Virgins."

Again with the virgins.

Why religious fanatics place so much stock in virgins is beyond me. When they finally turn on you, it's not the orgy the Great Leader might have imagined.

If we run down the list of Republican Presidential "candidates" in 2016, Heinlein's story is way off because I don't think any of them know any virgins, their protestations to the contrary.

Except for Ted Cruz's wife and mother. But that's by choice, and good for them.

Trump may keep a virgin or two on retainer in case they come in handy when Putin makes his first state visit, but I suspect they'll end up voting for the Democratic candidate.

Better health plan. And they get to be examined by a real gynecologist, instead of the ham-fisted Donald personally rummaging around down there on a whim.

And if Huckabee is counting on Ted Nugent's virgins to be there in a pinch, someone had better pinch him because the lad has been sorely mislead.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

Again with the virgins.

Why religious fanatics place so much stock in virgins is beyond me.

All that repressed sexytime gets them cranky?

[Hartmut]

Hey, only with virgins you can combine sex with bloodspilling without risking a charge of assault and/or causing bodily harm.

[wj]

Hartmut, you are assuming facts not in evidence. To wit that said virgins were a) willing and b) above the age of consent.

Neither of which, admittedly, seem to be of much interest to the enthusiasts. (Or maybe they just can't wrap their heads around the idea that they might not be universally desirable.)

[Hartmut]

If they are 'proper' virgins neither a) nor b) are of any matter.
Some cynics say though that the Prophet (peas beans upon him) actually disguised his true hell as heaven since what sane person would want to deal with 39 permanent virgins for eternity. A bloody mess each time just to start with.

[Slartibartfast]

Since the snow, our intermittent mouse problem has become a serious mouse problem.

Sounds as if they have a way in.

Long story here, folded origami-style, for brevity:

We've had a rash of mouse corpses. The cat has been dragging them out of nowhere, seemingly. It was one of those things we told ourselves we'd fix when we had the time. Where could mice possibly be getting in?

We've also had this cold wind blowing through the cat door cut into the door to the basement. I'd bought some materials to seal and insulate the rim joist, but had no time to do it last year. After Thanksgiving this year we had some very cold weather, so I unilaterally moved the rim joist job to the top of the priority queue. Also, there's the upcoming remodel of one room in the basement for my office/man cave, and the installation of a third bath there.

So: I started tearing down insulation. Had to, to access the rim joist. Plus: the guy who built the place for reasons unknown insulated the basement ceiling, with paper-backed fiberglass. There were at least a couple dozen dead mice in the insulation.

The rim joist leaked air like crazy; also it leaked where the sill sat on the block wall. I hand-cut 2" pink poly foam sheets to size and used Great Stuff to seal around the edges, and along the sill. Everything worked like a charm; messy but effective. The wind slowed down a lot but didn't quite stop. Finally, after I'd sealed maybe 3/4 of the rim joist, I found it. Someone had installed a hose bib and drilled the hole way too big. Big enough for mice to just walk in on top of the pipe.

Plus, airflow.

I sealed it. No more mice. No more wind. Comfortable house.

Ends. You probably need to find where they are getting in. I've heard other stories, as ridiculous or more.

[Doctor Science]

Slarti:

oh, if only. The house is a 100-year-old stone hunting lodge, set in the side of a hill. *Possibly* we can block up the holes letting them into the kitchen .. . maybe, if we're lucky.

At least your cat is competent.

[Nombrilisme Vide]

The cat who I grew up with killed mice up until perhaps a month before his death at 19. Admittedly, the last one he killed I literally picked him up, carried him to the rubbish bin it was behind, and simultaneously picked up the bin and set down the cat. I will stipulate, however, that the mouse was gone perhaps 3-4 seconds (and precisely 2 bites) later.

So yeah, I'm gonna agree your cat is plainly not the sports model.

[cleek]

i found a couple of mouse hind-parts and snouts behind the tool storage shelves when we moved out last week. cannibalistic mice, i assume. or angry skinks.

[wj]

What bugs me is the sound of little feet running in the walls. But it's never entirely certain whether it is mice (or rats), or maybe just quail running on the roof next to the (second story) bedroom. Ah, the joys of country life!

[Countme-In]

One of the Republican candidates for Serial-Murderer-In-Chief can't explain:

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal-a/2016_01/ted_cruz_still_cant_outline_an059455.php

Hannibal Lechter could at least explain his taste for human flesh, unlike this subhuman piece of psychopathic slime, Ted Cruz, and his fellow cold-blooded killers, including Paul Ryan.

We're a disgrace, the lot of us.

[Hartmut]

wj, no Delapore in the family I hope ;-)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rats_in_the_Walls

[wj]

Nah.

Plus Lovecraft never seems to get out of New England. So I've got almost 3,000 miles of buffer. ;-)

[Hartmut]

He has a few stories set (at least partially) in other places including the British Isles, Northern Canada, the South Sea, Inner Africa, and one story takes place on Mars (without any eldritch abominations involved in this one).

[Donald Johnson]

We had a mouse problem in our building once. We found this out when I looked over from the computer ( probably reading ObiWi) and saw a mouse in the bowl eating cat food.

[Doctor Science]

wj:

You think little feet are the problem. HAH!

I spent a week of a very hot summer in my late grandmother's (un-ACed of course) house in Wisconsin, listening every night to the BATS in the attic. running across the floor, back and forth to the window. Mice are nothing by comparison.

[wj]

Oh, little feet aren't the ONLY problem. Just the previous topic.

When the turkeys run across the roof next to my head, it sounds like Godzilla thundering by. Heck of a way to wake up in the morning.

[Countme-In]

Had a buddy who lived in the hills of Kowloon way back when, and I would visit him when I lived in the Philippines.

I slept in the upstairs of his cottage. One day he mentioned that not too long before one of my visits he and his girlfriend were hanging about doing nothing in particular and suddenly this snake appeared across the room from behind a piece of furniture, it's head and then body periscoping toward the ceiling in the corner.

Someone threw something at it and it dropped out of sight and slithered off to who knows where.

Could have been a common rat snake or a Burmese python, which are not poisonous. Maybe a the Banded Krait, the Many banded Krait, Chinese Cobra, King Cobra, Coral Snake, and the Red Necked Keelback, which are pretty common thereabouts, though no one said anything about markings, it happened so fast.

I didn't think much of it then, being fairly blase after living in the Philippines, where cobras would terrorize the coeds on the streets at the University of the Philippines in Los Banos, south of Manila.

Plus, we drank a lot during those visits, so when I went to bed upstairs, I was past worrying, if you know what I mean.

Now, I 'd die of fright, with any mice or other varmints climbing up my legs as refuge and expiring with me if I caught a glimpse of such a serpent on the house.

[russell]

Cat *smell* can keep mice away.

On the whole, I think I'd rather have mice.

[hairshirthedonist]

When the turkeys run across the roof next to my head, it sounds like Godzilla thundering by. Heck of a way to wake up in the morning.

It seems in the last 10 years or so, turkeys have proliferated in the burbs I live in. I've never heard of turkeys running across anyone's roof. I can imagine it would be loud, because they aren't even a little bit small (as birds go), but the idea of them running across the roof is really weird to me. (I don't doubt your story. It's just weird.)

[Slartibartfast]

The house is a 100-year-old stone hunting lodge

My condolences ;)

If you've made it all civilized, and sheetrocked and insulated the interior, your odds of finding the point(s) of entry just went down a lot.

In Florida, most of what we had to worry about was ants. Here, just waiting for the other shoe to drop.

or angry skinks

"Angry Skinks" could be a good name for a band.

When the turkeys run across the roof next to my head

I'm assuming you have some sort of heritage breed. Broad-breasted white or bronze = too big to really fly up any appreciable distance. Our Thanksgiving turkey this year was a 35-lb (ready to cook weight) tom. But he was the giant among them; the rest of them were more like 25 lb, dressed.

We still have 2 of them in our freezer. NB: smoked turkey makes a very, very tasty gumbo.

[wj]

Not entirely sure what kind of turkeys these are. (My wife is the bird enthusiast. Not me.) All I know is that they definitely get up on the (first floor) roof from time to time. And, in mating season, sometimes take to making their displays in the middle of the road out front. Which is a hassle for those of us on the court who are trying to, you know, drive to and from our houses.

Turkeys aren't native to California, of course. The story is that someone in the area was raising them in the back yard as a hobby (i.e. not for meat). When he died, his wife just opened the back gate and let them out. Only a handful then, by my how they have proliferated! And wander the open space around here for miles.

Well, as human impacts to the ecology go, this seems like one of the more benign ones. Except when I want to sleep in and they are waking me up.

[Countme-In]

'"Angry Skinks" could be a good name for a band'

https://thedustdiveflash.bandcamp.com/album/dave-hickey-and-the-skinks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1vS-Htq7Bc

[hairshirthedonist]

From the UN on reparations for African Americans in the US.

This sentence boggles my so-called mind:

Seventy-eight percent of white respondents said that slavery was "not a factor at all" or a "minor factor" contributing to black Americans' lower average wealth today.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

HSH: see, the "slavery" doesn't cause the "poverty", they're separate things!

Of course, both are a direct result of BLACKNESS. Gotta get the causation correct, doncha know.

[russell]

No turkeys on the roof in my neighborhood, but turkeys in the yard and in the street.

They sometimes create traffic problems. They walk very slowly, and if you beep at them or otherwise try to move them along, they seem to take it as a personal affront. Basically they just stop in the road and argue with you, in turkey-ese.

"I'm walking here", sez Tom Turkey. Road rage, with pin feathers.

We have a pretty good assortment of wildlife for a very densely populated suburban area. Turkey, geese, doves, the usual rabble of little feeder birds, hawks, squirrels, rabbits, mice, raccoons, skunks, foxes, coyotes.

No hunting around here, so most of them are surprisingly unafraid of humans. The coyotes and foxes are extremely shy, but the rest of the crew don't seem bothered by people at all.

Even the rabbits will hang out if you don't make sudden movements.

I think they've basically always been around, they're just losing habitat in the form of undeveloped land, so they're moving into the hood. No place else to go.

We're about halfway from winter solstice to spring equinox, which means it's mating time for the squirrels and skunks, so it's probably going to be noisy and smelly for the next week or two.

[russell]

No turkeys on the roof in my neighborhood, but turkeys in the yard and in the street.

They sometimes create traffic problems. They walk very slowly, and if you beep at them or otherwise try to move them along, they seem to take it as a personal affront. Basically they just stop in the road and argue with you, in turkey-ese.

"I'm walking here", sez Tom Turkey. Road rage, with pin feathers.

We have a pretty good assortment of wildlife for a very densely populated suburban area. Turkey, geese, doves, the usual rabble of little feeder birds, hawks, squirrels, rabbits, mice, raccoons, skunks, foxes, coyotes.

No hunting around here, so most of them are surprisingly unafraid of humans. The coyotes and foxes are extremely shy, but the rest of the crew don't seem bothered by people at all.

Even the rabbits will hang out if you don't make sudden movements.

I think they've basically always been around, they're just losing habitat in the form of undeveloped land, so they're moving into the hood. No place else to go.

We're about halfway from winter solstice to spring equinox, which means it's mating time for the squirrels and skunks, so it's probably going to be noisy and smelly for the next week or two.

[hairshirthedonist]

We have a pretty good assortment of wildlife for a very densely populated suburban area. Turkey, geese, doves, the usual rabble of little feeder birds, hawks, squirrels, rabbits, mice, raccoons, skunks, foxes, coyotes.

We don't have coyotes (yet), but it sounds very much like where I live. I'm going to guess you left off deer purely as an oversight. We also get some very large turkey buzzards, and bald eagles are making a comeback. Oh, and groundhogs (at least that's what I think they are).

[CharlesWT]

The populations of many sorts of wildlife is much higher in the suburbs than they ever were in undeveloped areas due to ready sources of food and a shortages of predators.

[Donald Johnson]

We have a massive number of deer. Sometimes turkeys show up. There was a pair of coyotes in the area a few years ago and I used to see skunks, though not in a long time. Though we smell them occasionally.

On another note, an American politician has finally spoken out against our support of the Saudi war in Yemen. I haven't read the speech yet, just the Daniel Larison piece on it. It's Senator Murphy (D from CT)

http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/sen-murphy-calls-for-ending-u-s-support-for-war-on-yemen/

[russell]

I'm going to guess you left off deer purely as an oversight.

Oh yeah, we have them, too. Not so many, but some.

My wife and I were almost knocked down by a small-ish deer trying to cross the road one day when we were out for a walk.

But they mostly stay in the wildlife areas.

[Slartibartfast]

I totaled my wife's Prius, hitting a decent-sized buck at about 45mph. I can't forget the deer.

Good think we don't have elk, here.

We have a decent-sized Great Pyrenees who, in concert with my dad/neighbor's Maremma (another large-ish herding breed), discourage the skunk, rabbit, coyote, wild dog and other pests. I don't know if my dog could actually take a coyote, but she thinks and acts like she can. She's unbelievably athletic. I've seen her run off 3 cocky lab-sized dogs when they thought they'd gang up on her.

If you don't think an 85-lb dog can chase down and catch a rabbit, you haven't seen either of our dogs in action.

[Countme-In]

The shortages of predators in the suburbs includes humans, given that gunfire is only permitted inside the houses, not near the houses.

Around my childhood home in the wooded suburbs of Pittsburgh, the deer graze in the yards near the house, the better to avoid hunters now commissioned to thin their mighty ranks all year round, even at night.

Apparently it's dangerous to walk the roads at night, but I've yet to be impaled by an arrow.

In Colorado, coyotes are everywhere. Last year, a large one skulked about and stole a softball from the outfield during one of my team's batting practices. Off he went, ball in mouth, to add to his collection.

Bears are caught up trees, as are mountain lions in the suburbs along the Front Range.

I've see more bears along the front range near civilization-- three -- than I have hiking and backpacking for over nearly 40 years in the Rocky Mountains, though I may have heard one once in the underbrush hustling out of there.

Came upon one in Banff, Canada, digging under some tree roots, but he was busy. A black bear, not a grizzly, because I'd have keeled over from a heart attack, especially after seeing "The Revenant".

I've never seen a mountain lion in the wilderness, but I'm sure plenty have seen me.

They have warning signs at most trail heads telling the hiker that mountain lions like to perch on rocky outcroppings and spy you from above.

Welp, every single trail in the mountain is basically a buffet table between rocky outcroppings to either side the entire journey, so .... ?

I've been hiking near tree line in the Rockies when great herds of elk -- maybe 150 at a time, come out of the treeline like dinosaurs in Jurassic Park stampeding.

I'd love to see a Tyrannosaurus Rex in pursuit, but no such luck.

[wj]

Size is handy for an animal defending its territory, but it isn't everything.

As someone once explained it to me: "Imagine a man walking in the woods, and he turns a corner to see a bobcat snarling and spitting in the middle of the trail. There is not a man born, no matter how large or athletic, who will not take a fast step backwards." For all that any adult will outweigh a bobcat several times over.

[hairshirthedonist]

I saw a juvenile grizzly in Banff. I was on horseback, along with about 20 other people (we each had our own horse, btw - not sharing). He seemed to be rooting around for berries or something about 20 yards off to the side of the trail we were on. He popped up to get a look at us, but soon went back to his business as we were still passing him. (The guides told us not to pause for photo-taking.)

Supposedly, a bear sees a human on horseback as a single, large creature and is ulikely to mess with it, let alone 20 of them, unless seriously threatened.

[Doctor Science]

A couple of days ago, Mr Dr Science took this picture out of our bedroom window.

He didn't know, then, that I had awakened a few hours before, and had seen the doe (sleeping on the left) standing between that stone wall and the window, eating plants growing on the wall. If the window hadn't been there I could certainly have touched her. The yearling (sleeping on the right) had been just a few feet further from the house.

As I used to say at our old house (only a couple miles from here), "we could get deer if all we had was a baseball-bat season."

[Slartibartfast]

If I had a Hummer (the original model) I'd drive with less caution than I now do. I'd want a winch and external mounting features for to winch the dead animals out of the brush where they'd been catapulted, and the rack to mount them outside the vehicle on the drive to the meat-processing plant.

I'm not sure if I have to use a tag for that. I have to check local laws.

Any folks from the north-central US here? Venison pasties are quite good.

[Countme-In]

Aim better and the deer could come thru the windshield and ride shotgun with you to the processing plant.

Or mount a big scoop on the front end with some kind of trapping jaws on it and off you go.

[hairshirthedonist]

You might need Joe Pesci to borrow his mother's knife so you can cut off the foot/paw/hoof if it get's caught in the grill.

[Yama]

We had a couple of convenience store robberies last week up the street from our laboratory. The local cops were swarming the woods around us.

The neighborhood is often visited by disoriented deer getting lost in the roads and backyards. When I headed out to lunch, I saw several cops, a dad and two little girls, and a dead deer along the road. No damaged vehicles; it looked like the deer must have made the cops nervous. Very surreal scene. Them deer have no respect I tell ya.

[Slartibartfast]

That buck must have looked like he was going for his gun.

[Snarki, child of Loki]

Slarti; rumor has it that any roadkill you collect counts in your bag limit.

Best scheme I heard of: deer "feeders" for the burbs, with feed that has contraceptives, and a feeder that rubs some anti-tick pesticide into the fur to put a dent in Lyme disease.

If the damned deer get TOO tame, I might have to teach them to 'bow', like the ones in Nara.

[russell]

In northern New England, folks generally don't let road kill go to waste. Large animals, anyway.

In Vermont and Maine, game wardens and local cops usually know folks who will take and use carcasses that aren't too badly mangled.

In Maine, specifically, I think that if you hit large game with your car, you get first dibs on the carcass.

New Hampshire used to freeze them and auction them off, I think they may still do that.

Rutting season is when you really have to watch out, the bucks get really aggressive and reckless. They've been known to attack cars.

[russell]

The ins and outs of roadkill as a food source.

[bobbyp]

If the doe goes, the buck stops here.

-anon.

[hairshirthedonist]

In northern New England, folks generally don't let road kill go to waste. Large animals, anyway.

This was southern NE, but a co-worker when I was in SE CT in the late 90s happened upon a freshly-hit deer on his way to meeting me for dinner in Mystic. He was from Arkansas, drove a pick-up, and was a pretty avid hunter. The deer was hit by some yuppie types in a Volvo wagon. It was January or February and quite cold that night, so spoilage wasn't a concern.

He showed up a little late, very excitedly telling me he had a deer in the back of his truck and that we had to go to Tom's (another co-worker native to CT) house to gut it. (After some pleading, the state trooper who was on the scene begrudgingly helped him get it into the bed of his truck. I wish I could have been there for that conversation.)

We went to Tom's, they gutted it, and Tom sliced up the heart and fried it in butter with some peppers and onions. We ate it while watching a UConn basketball game, only a couple of hours after it had been beating in the deer's chest.

That's my one and only story of eating road-kill.

[cleek]

in my neck of the woods, any fresh deer kills can be taken to the local Big Cat Rescue and where it will be fed to the lions and tigers and bobcats and lynx.

[wj]

When I was growing up (no idea what current policy is), roadkill in California were generally collected by the county sheriffs. And, IIRC, used to help feed the inmates at the county jail -- definitely a savings on tax dollars. Waste not, want not.

[Slartibartfast]

We also have a big cat rescue. Deceased cattle, goats, etc can also be brought there for dinner.

Place scares the hell out of me. It would scare the hell out of any sane person, I think. A lot of those cats come from (I am not making this up) people's homes. Who kept them as pets. Around their kids. More than one cat was in the rescue because CFS gave the parents a choice: either the cat goes, or we take the kid. This is one of the rare instances where I agree with CFS 100%, as regards intervention.

Normally I say: let people remove themselves from the gene pool. But once they've reproduced, their kids deserve a bit more of a chance than the idiot parents sometimes give them.

We're talking tigers. Lions. Cheetahs. Dunno about leopards; those tend to be so aggressive that even crazy people don't keep them as pets.

Some of the cats are from defunct circuses, or have simply gotten too old for the circus to use them. They're all probably better off in the rescue places; ours has fairly large containment areas where the cats at least have room to move about.