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May 05, 2015

Comments

A fair number of people on the far left think 9/11 was an inside job. I don't know what fraction. The planes didn't do it, the towers were brought down by explosives, etc...

Those, of course, are not people holding public office. If anything, I think lefties in public office are probably too reluctant to criticize the government for its actual wrongdoing. But anyway, no, my commenters on websites aren't the equivalent of a Texas governor.

Jesse Ventura was a Truther, wasn't he? But not a lefty, afaik.

Jesse wasn't really lefty, wasn't really righty, sort of off in his own dimension.

See? It always comes back to the Quaternions.

IMO, the USA should absolutely NOT annex Texas, and any paperwork to that effect should be voided.

Doesn't the 9/11-truther thing have adherents in the anti-government far right, also? If so, is that a matter of right and left losing their meanings when taken to their extremes?

Is there much of a right/left complexion to lunar-landing hoaxers?

It seems anti-vaxers come from both sides, AFAICT.

Obviously it is a pre-emptive strike.

No doubt the DoD has heard folks proclaiming: "Hang onto your Confederate money, boys! The South will rise again!"

"Hang onto your Confederate money, boys! The South will rise again!"

Even more amusing from a paper vs. gold money point of view.

people sure are working hard for the low-IQ conspiracy-theorist vote. is it really that big of a constituency?

Lyndon LaRouch claims to be a "New Deal Democrat".

A fair number of people on the far left think 9/11 was an inside job.

That particular conspiracy theory is not specific to the left.

Conservatives often say that liberals support redistributive programs because it buys them votes.

I often think that conservatives pander to Hofstadter's paranoid stylists for the same reason.

I have no idea how the country is supposed to function when people are this afraid of their own government.

I have no idea how the country is supposed to function when people are this afraid of their own government.

What I'd like to know is, is there there some other country whose government they would trust (more)? If so, shouldn't they just go there? If not, maybe they should be developing a colony in space. (To become a member of that colony, you must first believe the colony is a hoax.)

Dennis Kucinich famously introduced a bill involving chemtrails.

Kookiness (even only the apparent kind) isn't monopolized by the right.

But the party in power is smug; the party out of power is insane. Expect it.

If so, shouldn't they just go there?

Love it or leave it baby! ;-)

"In power" vs. "out of power" may be purely subjective on the part of the parties in question, I admit.

From the left, there was California Democratic Congresswoman Maxine Waters, who was out in front pushing Jim Webb's Dark Alliance scandal/conspiracy re: CIA involvement in the crack cocaine epidemic.

That falls well short of this, yeah.

Kucinich believes in several kooky ideas, some of which appear in the Consitution. He was pretty much the only Congressman or Senator who wanted a vote on the US's involvement in Libya.

Rick Perry!

"I think it's OK to question your government — I do it on a pretty regular basis," Perry said. "The military's something else."

If the military's something else, maybe they've already taken over!

Remind me of what was kooky about Gary Webb?

https://consortiumnews.com/2014/09/26/the-ciamsm-contra-cocaine-cover-up/

The Nation had a piece that dealt in part with Maxine Waters and Gary Webb--

http://m.thenation.com/blog/190193-racism-drove-backlash-against-gary-webb

I've found that Ted Cruz makes more sense if you think of him saying "you rubes!" at the end of most of his sentences.

Same with Rand Paul except it's "Zoinks!"

At least Obama isn't trying to nuke Texas, like he did Charleston.

I've found that Ted Cruz makes more sense if you think of him saying "you rubes!" at the end of most of his sentences.

Cruz makes the most sense to me when I imagine him saying everything he says while gazing raptly into a mirror.

Lot of that going around, though.

russell - why not combine the two!

From one of ugh's links:

Lindsay Graham:

"Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC) told Bloomberg on Saturday that he was unaware of any conspiracy theories or fear surrounding Jade Helm 15."

Also, Lindsay Graham:

http://www.vox.com/2015/3/11/8193751/lindsey-graham-military-coup

Seems like the murderous, fascist Republican vermin in Congress and the Texas State House would find right now a good time to demand deep budget CUTS in the military budget, specifically a line-item veto of funds for Operation Neuter Texas Conservatives, or whatever it's called.

But no, as you can see from Perry's and others comments, they express solidarity with our boys in uniform even as our boys in uniform mass in their midst to arrest and execute every conservative Texan (there are two, maybe three, who will be spared) they can apprehend and shackle inside the Nation's railroad cattle car fleet, which has been quietly moved into position as well in recent months, one hopes.

Ya know, Ma, the elevation of credence in paranoid cockamamie horsesh*t, like this latest, in this country to influential members of our political elite, almost exclusively on the conservative side, as much as we feel the need to reference outliers like Kucinich and Waters, I guess, to help us believe EVERYONE is f*cking nuts, and to the mainstream media is .... corrosive to what's left of civility, a nice way of saying why don't the Governors of Texas and their panderees go f*ck themselves once and for all.

"I have no idea how the country is supposed to function when people are this afraid of their own government."

Dear Mom:

Bingo! The entire point of the conservative bowel movement is to make the country ungovernable.

Scuttlebutt has it that once we've cleaned out this multi-million person rat's nest of conservatives in Texas, we're deploying north, east, and west to liquidate conservative elements in the rest of the country.

Frankly Mom, I haven't seen anything quite like the reception we're receiving down here south of the real border of the United States.

On the one hand, prominent conservatives claim publicly that they respect we, the military, as the bulwark of the nation against its enemies, foreign and domestic, and yet that have little inkling that they are the sworn enemies of everything good this country stands for, as we know from their treatment of immigrants and the 25% of their populace who are virtually shut out of the healthcare market by decree of those inside the Texas State House and the Governor's Mansion, which by the way, I guess I can now divulge, we will be soon razing like so many Taliban strongholds.

I mean THIS is a former Governor of the place who out of one side of his mouth can't stop drawling his devotion to the military, but out of the other refuses to comply with military orders to disarm and desist from his attempted ruination of the country:

http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/rick-perry-sean-hannity-patrol-border/

Perry and Hannity have no clue of what the military faces in warfare, but they are about to find out.

The two of them had to be outfitted with butt plugs and frequent changes of trousers while on that gunboat, which by the way was on the border between Oklahoma and Texas, not on the Mexican border.

Every time the border Patrol gunned that boat, the two of them shat their pants, thinking it was Obama clearing his throat and getting ready to jump out from behind a cactus and yell "Boo!"

They don't understand the position they are in this here Operation Sphincter Fisting.

They are in harm's way.

And my middle name is "Harm".

In 1988, the Anti-American terrorist and guerilla leader Newt Gingrich formally declared War on more than half this country's people, its government, and its way of life.

“This war has to be fought with a scale and a duration and a savagery that is only true of civil wars", he puked.

This Operation is just a skirmish in that Civil War.

Gingrich doesn't know what true savagery is, but he is about to find out.

He and his counterparts had better hide like Saddam Hussein in his hidey hole.

Here we come, motherf*ckers.

No offense, Mom, I don't mean you, but you need to know the stakes in this Civil War declared on US by THEM.

Say Hi to Pop and tell Sis that, yeah, that WAS a human ear in the package I sent.

Let's just say Sean Hannity is going to need some plastic surgery to hold his shades and backwards ball cap on next time he wants to mess with the U.S. military.

Like the man said: Savagery

But anyway, no, my commenters on websites aren't the equivalent of a Texas governor.

This is the link to the governor's letter, fwiw:

http://gov.texas.gov/files/press-office/20150428125759.pdf

Honestly, the entire thing seems a little exaggerated to me. Yeah, I get there are some conspiracy nuts out there (*cough* infowars *cough*) calling the governor's office, but his response seemed fine.

Maybe major metropolitan police departments could send out letters similar to the Texas Governor's to every resident in their cities, say, daily.

Let me get this right, the Governor of Texas is alarmed enough by his madhatter constituents' "concerns" about the threat to their precious bodily fluids by the largest, most powerfully armed military in the history of the world doing maneuvers in their midst, but he falls all over himself butt-licking the same military his constituents are wetting their pants over because the boys in uniform either might be, or might "not" be imposing martial law in the State of Texas.

I expect him to dispatch similar letters welcoming and praising the deep humanity, heroism, and patriotism of EPA and HHS employees armed with little more than clipboards who do maneuvers in his state to try to save his fellow Texans' lives by providing them access to healthcare and maybe keeping the joint a little cleaner than it might otherwise be.

He's a mealy-mouthed coward, afraid of his own shadow, who can't stand up to ignorant sh*theads because sh*thead ignoramuses make up the base of his political support.

He's a murderer to boot.

As a patriotic American, I demand we send our boys and girls in their to take him out, feet first.

in "there"!

Dismissed, Mandrake!

his response seemed fine.

If this whole thing is a "little exaggerated", no response is necessary.

I have no vested interest in the career of Dennis Kucinich, past or present (or future?), but it appears his "chemtrail" connection has been significantly over-rated

I don't think there is any doubt that all corners of the political spectrum have their resident kooks.

But, is there any disagreement? The righties do it best.

The only time leftwingers were even competitive with RW kookery was in the 60's when (some of) the Gummit was actaully out to get (some of) them.

But the kooky LWers lose interest: smoking some pot, play with the dog, have some casual sex, and *what was it, again?*. NOTHING like the work-ethic of your RW kook.

Now here's my kind of take on the recent civil unrest in Baltimore.

You may continue on with your regularly scheduled programming.

"I have no idea how the country is supposed to function when people are this afraid of their own government."

Well, keeping in mind that the country DNE the government, maybe the government could try backing off a bit? Resign itself to doing less? Make fewer things crimes? Not pass laws by one vote margins that set to massively change entire sectors of the economy?

Perhaps admit that the 4th amendment applies to the NSA? Abandon the practice of parallel construction?

People don't trust the government, because it gives us too many reasons not to trust it.

DNE?

A bit of disrespect is useful.

Paranoia at the Texas takeover level, stoked by lunatics - what was that one-vote deal? - is not.

The one vote thing was the ACA.

My God, why WOULD people trust the government? With the NSA siphoning up every bit of electronic data it can, 4th amendment be damned? The IRS and other government agencies turning themselves into partisan weapons? Laws accumulating faster than a human could read them? The people running the government being so crudely lawless?

Trust is earned, not the government's by right.

If this whole thing is a "little exaggerated", no response is necessary.

Actually, I think it's good form for elected officials to be responsive to their constituents. People contacted the governor, he responded with a 'no need to be concerned, but I'm making sure everybody knows what's going on'.

One vote?

Actually, blowing off the people concerned about this, no matter how irrational they might have been to be so concerned, would be the most effective way to help spread the concern. It would be perceived as a cover-up.

The most effective way to deal with paranoid concerns is to take them seriously, and patiently, sympathetically, refute them with relevant evidence, on their own terms, carefully NOT dismissing them as paranoid. And I say this as somebody who has dealt with an actual, diagnosed paranoid, over a long period of time.

One vote?

And on cue the government is proving Brett correct:

What Shayne’s online rumination helped unveil was a previously secret, multi-day campaign of overhead surveillance by city and federal authorities during a period of historic political protest and unrest.

One vote. Must have really burned Politifact to have to rate this one mostly true.

Really not a good idea, if you want both parties to trust government, to go around massively altering whole segments of the economy by party line votes.

"And I say this as somebody who has dealt with an actual, diagnosed paranoid, over a long period of time."

There you go talking about me on the internet again.

Humoring paranoids is one thing.

Electing them, or their enablers, to high office, as has become the custom way too often in recent years in Texas and elsewhere, is yet another.

Arming them to boot is paranoia-inducing for the rest of us.

But these are my people, says Louis Gohmert.

How do you know?

Because the pelicans sitting on their heads said so, replies Gohmert.

To paraphrase Joseph Heller, Woody Allen, and Kurt Cocaine, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean someone shouldn't finally tell you to shut your mouth.

"One Vote"

It takes two parties to tow the party line.

In more amenable, less mean-assed times when moderates were accepted into the Republican Party instead of tossed aside by the paranoid base, there might have been a few courageous souls would who would break party ranks for the good of the American people.

It'll be a party line vote when Obamacare is repealed as well. It will be a party line one vote majority if the Court throws the subsidies out.

Murder by one vote.

There will be no military that can protect what will be coming to the majority in that case.


That a 60-39 super-majority is being characterized as passing by "one vote" is ridiculous. What happened by one vote was the motion to end debate on the bill, based on the Senate rules.

Last 9 comments, 4 are Brett's. DNFTT please.

Trust is earned, not the government's by right.

And since the government is us, I guess that means that we cannot trust ourselves.

(Sorry, LJ, I just couldn't resist.)

de-annex TX. give it back to Mexico

I'm actually pretty unclear on why Texas joined the US in the first place. They've never seemed to be particularly happy about it.

What does DNE mean? Does Not Exist? Do Not Eat? Dance Now, Edward?

I appreciate that the governor of Texas wants to address the concerns of his constituents, but perhaps a more useful response might have been a simple "The federal government is not planning to impose martial law on the entire Southwest".

Although Brett's right, that probably would have been interpreted, more or less immediately, as proof of his collusion in the whole thing.

When I talk about distrust of government getting in the way of government being effective, I'm not talking about reasonable skepticism, or concern about demonstrated abuses.

I'm talking about people who think a Walmart closing for remodeling is clear evidence of the imposition of military rule.

I'm talking about bat-shit nutty buddy delusional paranoia.

How was your experience dealing with a clinical paranoid, Brett? Was it difficult to get that person to basically function effectively at a simple workaday level?

That's what I'm talking about.

Too many people are straight up nucking futs. The rest of us, who are just trying to get the bills paid and the roads paved and the lights kept on in the libraries, can't get anything done.

If you think the federal government is conducting secret military exercises to impose martial law on the entire southwest, you don't need to have your concerns addressed by the governor of your state. You need to adjust your meds.

Corporations, on the other hand, are not us. So we can distrust corporations with a clear conscience. Some of us can, anyway. Others claim that we (i.e. The Government) cannot be trusted to limit the power of corporations, even though they are creatures of The Government (i.e. us) in the first place. Nobody trusts anybody it seems.

--TP

Cleek, what injury did Mexico ever do to you???

what about Business Plot ? it seems good left equivalent of conspiracy theory.

Women in Washington D.C. have reason to be paranoid about their jobs if they use birth control:

http://blogs.rollcall.com/hill-blotter/paul-weighs-in-on-cruz-effort-to-block-d-c-law/

Yet another Texan and the son of a Texan mucking about where pig filth ought not to.

I encourage D.C. women to become appropriately and heavily armed to protect themselves from this further example of the Federal Government attempting to declare martial law and conduct maneuvers in their vaginas.

I suppose Cruz and Paul will next want to quarter federal troops in D.C. vaginas.

Then we'll have to order in the National Guard to keep an eye on the troops.

It could get very crowded and once the gunfire starts, as surely it will among dumbass Americans, think of the fetuses in the crossfire in such a small space.

One wonders if Cruz and Paul will fire their call girls, I mean, their wives, if the latter use birth control while shacking up in the District of Columbia.

Certainly condoms must be on the list of reasons for dismissal, aren't they?

Speaking of the Wal Mart closings, the employees at those six stores who engaged in pro-union activity are the ones who should be justifiably paranoid.

What plumbing issues?

http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/local-news/i-team-investigates/i-team-wal-mart-stores-that-were-suddenly-closed-for-plumbing-issues-havent-sought-permits

More conservative filth at work ruining people's lives.

Actually, I think it's good form for elected officials to be responsive to their constituents.

Oh, really? What has been the governor's response to poor women in rural areas desiring a legal abortion? It has been to ignore them.

Instead he wastes tax money pandering to far right politically motivated paranoia.

Clearly, the voices of some concerned citizens carry more weight than others, but let us laud him for showing "concern".

While this might make some kind of sense in your world, it certainly does not in mine.

http://gawker.com/governor-vows-to-defend-texas-against-insane-imaginary-1702015620

Clearly, the voices of some concerned citizens carry more weight than others

How could it be otherwise. Since (per the Supreme Court) money is speech, those with more money speak louder . . . and therefore more effectively. The voices of the rural poor are simply too soft in comparison for politicians like Perry and Cruz to notice.

"Does Not Equal"

What does DNE mean? Does Not Exist? Do Not Eat? Dance Now, Edward?

Pretty sure it's meant as "≠" (Does Not Equal).

I'm actually pretty unclear on why Texas joined the US in the first place.

Mexico outlawed slavery.

That's an oversimplification, but the basic facts are there: Texas broke away from Mexico to maintain slavery. Texas joined the US to make it easier for slavery to grow.

The past isn't dead.

"Oh, really? What has been the governor's response to poor women in rural areas desiring a legal abortion? It has been to ignore them."

That's just being responsive to the constituents they're killing.

"And since the government is us, I guess that means that we cannot trust ourselves."

And, since the government is us, I guess Freddie Grey committed suicide. So, what's the fuss?

Government is just the name we give to what some of us do to others of us.

As a European I find it very strange how distrust of authority/government has become monopolized by the right/libertarian wing of the political spectrum. Of course there have always been some statist lefties over here, but generally speaking the right was and is authoritarian and it is a defining feature of the left to question all authority.

the first sentence refers to the US of course, sorry

I don't give a FF about the vote to end debate. The bill passed by 60-39.

And it would have gotten one or two Republican votes if McConnell had not been determined that no GOP senator vote for it.

In other words, the unanimous Republican opposition wasnot based on a unanimously held view that ACA was bad policy. It was based on pure partisanship - the kind that you are criticizing Democrats for. The partisan split was an artifact of Republican opposition, not an expression of honest differences.

Indeed, had the GOP sentors who had previouyslt supported the bll or something similar voted for it the margin would have been even greater than 19, which, you may recall from your math courses, is greater than 1.

Don't piss on our shoes and tell us it's raining.

that's not rain, that's government mind-control serum, distributed by black helicopters of the US Govt anti-Freedom Corps. duh.

"The most effective way to deal with paranoid concerns is to take them seriously, and patiently, sympathetically, refute them with relevant evidence, on their own terms,"

As opposed to telling them their fears are justified, I suppose, which is what Cruz and others are doing.

So how about a word on that?

it's almost as if people like Cruz and Paul find pandering to the wingnut rubes to be a better use of their energy than actually trying to appeal to the rest of the country. and that makes me think they're really just auditioning for Fox News or Newsmax jobs.

"And it would have gotten one or two Republican votes if McConnell had not been determined that no GOP senator vote for it."

And it would have lost several Democratic votes if Reid hadn't determined that no Democratic Senator could vote against it. Such is the nature of party line votes.

Frankly, I think Obama's MO would have ordered the military to suddenly and mysteriously close Costcos, instead of Walmarts, to temporarily house Texas conservatives for some rough, shackled interrogation as they await their train rides to oblivion.

At least the displaced former Costco workers re-employed for the ghastly, but patriotic work would have been paid a living wage and provided health care coverage to rout out right-wing terrorism along our Southern border, rather than summarily dismissed on short notice for dubious reasons.

Maybe, as a byproduct, we'd find out who really shot John F. Kennedy.

By the way, along with abortion services, some women and their fetuses in states that are hostile to legal abortion and do everything in their power to make those services inaccessible, also make fetal care to mothers and babies inaccessible as a result, along with the strenuous efforts to halt the expansion of Medicaid and Obamacare, without replacing those schemes with conservative alternatives to insure that all people can afford medical care, other than a nickel and a f*ck-off.

I'm surprised at the designation of fetuses as "constituents" with, I presume, voting rights now, considering that they don't speak or read English, presumably work in the underground economy and take the jobs that able-bodied unemployed Americans of working age would and should have, and to boot have no ID for voting purposes.

But I guess this explains why Ted Cruz, the entire Paul family, and Louie Gohmert always seem to be speaking to constituents with only partially-formed brains who can't raise their hands to throw in a discouraging word.

I suppose they are expressly suitable for hand-harvesting root crops like onions for below market wages, especially before they learn to walk (no stooping, everything is at eye-level), and they are not apt to provoke union-commie talk among their fellow laborers, because they can't talk yet.

Feeding breaks and nap times might be a burden on their employers, so there is that for conservative, market-oriented legislators to deal with, or not, probably not.

The fetuses will take the jobs and damned well like it.

Oh, you're teething? Let me play a little violin for you as you fill onion bag number nine, sorry, we've raised it to ten, for your piece-work wage.

Are they not immigrants and anchor babies by any other name, probably Gertrude or Randall?

At least in Chicago, you have to have lived a full life and paid taxes for years before dying and then being placed on the voting rolls to vote in perpetuity.


And it would have lost several Democratic votes if Reid hadn't determined that no Democratic Senator could vote against it. Such is the nature of party line votes.

Yes. Are those goalposts heavy?

Why are you complaining about "one vote?" Balance the Republicans who cast partisan votes against with the Democrats who cast partisan votes for and you end up with a substantial majority for the bill.

In other words all the "rammed through by one vote" is utterly dishonest BS. I'm surprised a hard-nosed "nothing but the facts" guy you pretend to be falls for it. Yet you consistently do.

novakant: the US RW goes completely authoritarian when they are in power, but goes anti-government when out of power.

IOW, "authoritarian, when THEY are the authority".

Actually, blowing off the people concerned about this, no matter how irrational they might have been to be so concerned, would be the most effective way to help spread the concern. It would be perceived as a cover-up.

The thing is, this is probably exactly right. Which is sort of my point.

Want to run a military exercise? First you have to talk all of the people who assume it's a covert op to impose martial law down off of the ledge.

Lather rinse and repeat for nearly every aspect of normal government operations.

The most effective way to deal with paranoid concerns is to take them seriously, and patiently, sympathetically, refute them with relevant evidence, on their own terms, carefully NOT dismissing them as paranoid.

Again, you make my point.

To get anything done, whatsoever, we first have to calm the fears of the fairly significant portion of the population whose understanding of things is founded in fear-mongering lies.

What you are recommending here is therapy at a mass scale, not the operation of a polity.

If we have to handle double-digit percentages of the population as if they were clinical psychiatric patients, we're screwed.

The correct, sane, and normal response of a governor of a state to widespread fears that a military exercise is a secret putsch to impose martial law is "No, actually it's just a military exercise".

When a response like "I understand your concerns, I will direct the National Guard to observe the exercise" is required to keep everybody from flying off the freaking handle, you are in fact operating a clinic, not a state.

Next week, county sheriffs will be required to follow postal carriers around to make sure they aren't compiling classified dossiers on our magazine subscriptions.

Such is the nature of party line votes.

If I may offer an editorial comment:

If there is one thing in the entire planet I am not interested in, it is hearing anyone who identifies, however remotely, as a conservative, of whatever stripe, b*tching about party line votes.

Seriously, it's either a joke, or trolling.

I appreciate that the governor of Texas wants to address the concerns of his constituents, but perhaps a more useful response might have been a simple "The federal government is not planning to impose martial law on the entire Southwest".

He issued a one page letter to the Texas state guard to monitor the exercise and ensure local residents and governments are informed, and said there is no risk:

"U.S. Special Operations Command (USSOCOM) has assured Texas that each location selected for training exercises will pose no risk to residents or property and that they will coordinate with local residents via verbal and written coordination."

Perhaps its not as minimal a response as you would like, but its a fairly minimal response. And I think the response to it has been exaggerated. For example, the Gawker headline 'Governor Vows to Defend Texas Against Insane Imaginary Obama Invasion', that bobbyp linked.

The Gawker link above also includes lines such as: Rand Paul recently warned that the operation is “the same thing that happened in Nazi Germany.” ...which doesn't seem to be true, or supported by the link Gawker provided.

which doesn't seem to be true, or supported by the link Gawker provided.

that "Nazi Germany" quote was from Bob Wells. bobbyp's Gawker link misattributed it to Paul. they got it right in the other Gawker article that it links to.

looks like a case of sloppy reading on writer Sam Biddle's part, because the very next line after the "Nazi Germany" block quote is:

With that in mind, what did Rand Paul say when Mickelson asked what he knew about the operation?

he apparently assumed the preceding quote was also Paul's.

When a response like "I understand your concerns, I will direct the National Guard to observe the exercise" is required to keep everybody from flying off the freaking handle, you are in fact operating a clinic, not a state.

Alternatively:

"There was, frankly, an overreaction to the simple fact that someone has to be in charge with gathering and disseminating information," said Abbott, speaking to reporters for the first time since sending the letter. "We stepped in to play that role, which is a role to be applauded."

When asked whether addressing the issue legitimized fringe theories, Abbott said no. He said he was responding to citizen questions, which he said the government has an obligation to answer.

Some at the Bastrop County meeting questioned a U.S. Army commander about whether the government was planning to confiscate guns or implement martial law. Bastrop County Judge Paul Pape, who has thanked Abbott for his letter, said "conspiracy theorists" and "fearmongers" had been in a frenzy.

"I've seen nothing that would cause anybody to worry about what's going on," Abbott said.

http://www.kbtx.com/home/headlines/Texas-Governor-Criticism-to-Army-Training-Order-Overblown-302455951.html

as a resident of Pineland, let me reassure the dim-witted Infowars-addled rubes of Texas that they have nothing to fear from special forces training exercises.

"To get anything done, whatsoever, we first have to calm the fears of the fairly significant portion of the population whose understanding of things is founded in fear-mongering lies."

A good deal of our law and policy is based on fear mongering lies. The campus rape "crisis", for instance. The fight against concealed carry reform. You're pissed off because somebody is taking the trouble to calm unjustified fears?

troll harder

The campus rape "crisis", for instance. The fight against concealed carry reform. You're pissed off because somebody is taking the trouble to calm unjustified fears?

Yes, let's conflate things reasonable people can disagree on with outlandish nuttery.

"Hmmm, I'm not sure GMO-based food sources are safe for my family" (not something I would say, personally, mind you) and "My dog told me my next-door neighbors are space aliens plotting to destroy the earth and that I must kill them to save the planet" are equally ridiculous, I guess.

I think that to say that reasonable people can disagree on the campus rape crisis renders the term "reasonable" void of meaning. Rape is actually LESS common on college campuses than in surrounding communities. And yet absurd lies about the prevalance of rape on campus are being used to push the abolition of due process.

"There is a crisis with the way that police relate to the various communities they serve"

That's a concept on the Left that hits the Righties the same way the Texas Invasion does for those who don't think that way.

I mean, it won't hold up to logic, but nothing from the Left is as illogical as the US Government invading Texas. This is a close as I can come.

Try again, Brett. Women aged 18-24, who are enrolled in a a post-secondary program (full- or part-time college or university, trade school or vocational school), are less likely to be sexually assualted than women aged 18-24 who are not enrolled in a post-secondary program.

That's not the same thing, and it doesn't mean there isn't a specific and addressable problem with rape on campuses. I might not agree with every action universities have taken against accused perpetrators of sexual assault, either, but that's not the same thing as saying the concern over campus sexual assault is unfounded.

All of which demonstrates that you and I can reasonably disagree about the magnitude of this particular problem.

Never fear, hairshirtperidonist, your space alien neighbors perceive you and your family as an organic, non-GMO-based food source, suitable for snacking.

But just in case, the Governor of your state is sending out reassuring notes to the canine population to nip their paranoia in the bud.

Dogs, like paranoid constituents ripe for the humoring, tend to scrape their butts along the thick-pile carpet when they need attention and deworming.

By the way, there are 10 to 12 million constituents and their fetuses out there in the country who are getting a might bit paranoid about losing their health insurance coverage should all 35 right-wing Republican presidential candidates become President all at once.

That's a lot of new patrons down at the old shooting range.

A marketing opportunity there for the savvy entrepreneur.

A good deal of our law and policy is based on fear mongering lies. The campus rapevoter fraud "crisis", for instance.

You're pissed off because somebody is taking the trouble to calm unjustified fears?

Well, no. Amused? Yes. Next question.

He issued a one page letter to the Texas state guard to monitor the exercise and ensure local residents and governments are informed, and said there is no risk

I appreciate what you're saying here, and I appreciate your desire to not make this a bigger thing than it needs to be.

All of that said, the second paragraph of the one-pager to the TX Guard says:

During the training operation, it is important that Texans know their safety, constitutional rights, private property rights and civil liberties will not be infringed.

I think it's fine for the governor of TX to co-ordinate with USSOCCOM, via the guard or otherwise, to make sure that everyone knows what they need to know and to provide whatever guidance is needed to the military to make sure everything goes safely.

I think referring to possible infringements of constitutional and civil liberties is kind of wacky.

Maybe it's just optics, as they say, but that's how it looks to me.

Perhaps there is some history of the US military violating the constitutional rights and civil liberties of US citizens in the course of carrying out training exercises that I'm not aware of, in which case I'll be happy to say that I stand corrected.

But in general, I'd assume that assurances of that type would hardly need to be made by someone like a state governor.

YMMV

I suppose in the sense that any rate of rape higher than zero qualifies as a problem, sure, there's a "problem". Just less of a problem than everywhere else.

But that's not the same as saying that there's a crisis, or make the absurd lies about the rate of rape on campus reasonable. Look, at some point you have to be able to notice hysteria on your own side, or you've no standing to complain about it in opponents.

bobbyp,

The very fact that there is no evidence of a vote fraud crisis just proves what a brilliantly executed conspiracy it all is.

You just don't understand.

Just less of a problem than everywhere else.

Did you read the article you linked, Brett? (And, is it at all possible that people might expect college campuses to be safer than "everywhere else"?)

"... at some point you have to be able to notice hysteria on your own side, or you've no standing to complain about it in opponents."

Pot. Kettle.

I think referring to possible infringements of constitutional and civil liberties is kind of wacky.

right. it's pandering. saying he'll get the state guard to "monitor" the actions of the US special forces just gives credence to the delusions of fools. because there's nothing to monitor.

Here is the difference between concerns about campus rape, however overblown, and concerns about secret military takeovers of entire geographic regions of the country:

Rapes on campuses actually occur.

That is the difference. In case it wasn't clear, to anyone.

I'm not sure, but I suspect that dragging in unrelated topics, whether intended to derail conversation or not, qualifies, as a practical matter, as trolling.

when all else fails, change the subject

"The fight against concealed carry reform."

I presume you mean the fight against the fight for further concealed reform in the direction of open-carrying of weapons in public places.

As a card-carrying member of the Piscottaway Plenipotentiary Paranoids for Hysterical Paizogony, here's what I do when I see a bunch of dorks waving weapons around at Chili's while I'm dining on my fajitas.

I push my chair back, carefully refold my napkin, take that swig of beer, pick up a chair, and then I kick their f*cking asses before then can shoot me, because I don't pause to inquire about people's intentions when they brandish weapons in inappropriate venues, not knowing who the f*ck they are.

I'm a little jumpy that way. I'm not too calm either about some whack conceal carrying one pew over missing his left testicle and shooting me during the effing Doxology because he left the safety off and reached for the hymnbook.

What do you do?

Well now, if we require "standing" to wax hysterical about our opponents' hysteria, let's pull the plug on this internet thingy all together.

The entire country could use a hysteriarectomy.

I think referring to possible infringements of constitutional and civil liberties is kind of wacky.

Maybe it's just optics, as they say, but that's how it looks to me.

Yeah, I don't know that I would disagree with 'wacky', I just think the coverage has been exaggerated.

I imagine that phrasing was a way for the governor to indirectly acknowledge and dismiss the more ridiculous concerns with dignifying them with a direct response. Maybe that's charitable of me.

Keep in mind that, mixed in with the crazy, there were some (imo) reasonable concerns about property damage, loud noises, accidents, who coordinates with who, what is the point of contact for civilian or local emergency services questions, etc, that were raised at the now infamous Bastrop town hall meeting.

There was also a lot of crazy, don't get me wrong.

I think referring to possible infringements of constitutional and civil liberties is kind of wacky.

Well, you might feel differently if you live within 100 miles of the Mexican border.

You just don't understand.

My pretending to not understand is all part and parcel of the real conspiracy. I may be in deep doo-doo for just bringing it up.

Well, Britain kept the witch laws on the books long after (real) witch trials ended in order to assure the population that the government was still prepared and ready to react in case. We know that because that reason was given in disputes about striking the statute and prevailed. The state knew that its citizens still believed in witches and would see it as dereliction of duty, if the state struck the law. On the other hand the absence of rampant witchcraft could be sold as merit of constant state vigilance.
The same logic can be applied to the Texas governor. He wants to assure the paranoid that he is vigilant, so he can later (if the opportunity arises) claim that it was him (and only him) who protected them from them wicked Northerners.
Personally, I find the British example reasonable (for its time) but the Texan one as opportunistic and cynical.
Wait for anti-bear patrols on the Gulf coast.

Perhaps there is some history of the US military violating the constitutional rights and civil liberties of US citizens in the course of carrying out training exercises that I'm not aware of, in which case I'll be happy to say that I stand corrected.

Russell, what else do you call President Eisenhower sending in the Army to enforce unconstitutional court orders to desegregate various educational institutions? (OK, it wasn't billed as a "training exercise". But still....)

Seeing how I live in Texas, and my Facebook feed consists of a surprisingly high number of conservative Texans (relatives, for the most part), let me make something clear:

There is a non-trivial number of people absolutely flipping the f*ck out over this.

People who should darn well KNOW better are, at best, of the mind "Nothing about this sounds good." and a number of people who are, shall we say, somewhat low-informed voters are absolutely terrified.

In such an environment, what a responsible state official would DO is say -- in polite, diplomatic words -- "Stop being crazy. It's a regular military exercise, happens all the time, get a grip."

Instead, what he does is validate their fears. "We'll make sure people watch them" which sends the paranoid a message "Because they might do those things. We should be careful".

Abbot fed the delusion instead of starving it.

*sigh*. I've had it up to here with my fellow Texans and their stupidity. The stupid secessionists (seriously, guys, have you actually THOUGHT about how that would work? For starters, you can kiss your low taxes goodbye. Also, the US Army won't let you keep the tanks) and the moronic paranoids and ESPECIALLY the idiot suburbanites terrified of black thugs and government helicopters clutching their 9mm like an 'effing teddy bear.

This "OMG OBAMA SO SCARED OF TEXAS INVADING US" crap is just...good lord, I want to smack half my freaking relatives with a clue-by-four. Jesus Christ, it's like I'm surrounded by children. Inbred children. Inbred children barred from school, raised in a dark closet by insane people, and then let loose on the internet. And I don't even HAVE relatives in East Texas.

Yeah, when has the US military ever been turned on US citizens?

In a case of ridiculous conservative paranoia?

Army Chief of Staff MacArthur was convinced that the march was a communist conspiracy to undermine the government of the United States, and that "the movement was actually far deeper and more dangerous than an effort to secure funds from a nearly depleted federal treasury."

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