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August 04, 2009

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while US troops have been in Iraq for well over 6 years


$@@!#!#$$#!!!

It is probably unrealistic to think you can ever intervene in a civil war and make a long term solution. Sometimes it is best to let the war happen and have a clear victor. I don't think it would have been in the long term interest of the US to have Britian and France intervene in our Civil War. At best we would have been partitioned, with a long border with bitter enemies on either side.

Iraq is different since we kicked off the civil war, and it was reasonable and our responsibility to try and find a solution...but since it seems clear that we have done all we can in that regard, we should pull out and hope that whatever stability exists is enough to prevent catastrophe.

David Swanson remarks on how the deadline for holding a referendum by Iraqi voters on the U.S.-Iraq security agreement is passing with almost no notice by media, antiwar organizations, or foreign policy wonks.

He makes the point I made last year until I was blue in the face: the agreement signed by Maliki and Bush is not a Status of Forces Agreement but a treaty that also requires Senate ratification, no matter how convenient it now is for Pres. Obama and the Democratic leadership in the Senate to ignore it.

Before they were in power, Obama and Biden understood that. Now, as with state secrets, rendition, preventive detention, and so many other things, it's all good once you're the king.

Have seen references to Obama admin proposals for private military to be stationed in Iraq for all eternity. No longer able to dismiss that as implausible, but also lack stomach to research actual state of play. He's so much worse across the board than even my low, low expectations that I wonder how the true believers are handling the cognitive dissonance.

Have seen references to Obama admin proposals for private military to be stationed in Iraq for all eternity.

Would have to see a link to comment. Not sure there are enough private soldiers available (and they don't have the hardware), and considering Erick Prince just got the book thrown at him, I'd say unlikely.

He makes the point I made last year until I was blue in the face: the agreement signed by Maliki and Bush is not a Status of Forces Agreement but a treaty that also requires Senate ratification, no matter how convenient it now is for Pres. Obama and the Democratic leadership in the Senate to ignore it.

Not sure how this changes things. Also, it's incumbent on Congress to check the executive. Obama shouldn't overreach, but all Presidents will. Only Congress/the SCOTUS can stop them.

David Swanson remarks on how the deadline for holding a referendum by Iraqi voters on the U.S.-Iraq security agreement is passing with almost no notice by media, antiwar organizations, or foreign policy wonks.

I've been remiss, but that's because I've seen it coming for so long the actual passing of the event was so ho-hum.

Right now, Maliki doesn't want a referendum because it would imperil the deal he has - which is to his advantage. He controls the timing, and can extract maximum concessions for any potential extension.

The referendum (demanded by Sistani) was useful when he was negotiating the original SOFA because he could use it as a warning for the US to: (a) not overreach; and (b) give in to his demands.

After getting (a) and (b), Maliki and Sistani will table the referendum - put it off until the next round of bargaining to be used in the same way.

In that sense, Swanson is wrong to call Maliki a puppet. He's getting the better of this deal, and the minute he and/or Sistani think otherwise, they can show us the exit.

Barbara Walter (not to be confused, of course, with "Barbara Walters"):

[...] If the U.S. wants to avert this scenario, it will need to create real incentives for Maliki and the Shiites to offer a fair deal that transfers real political power to the Sunnis and Kurds by the 2011 deadline, and then it needs to help them enforce it over time. This would require that those 50,000 "support troops" remain in Iraq until the new political institutions are firmly established, something most experts believe will take an additional five to 10 years.

One of the most robust findings in the civil war literature is the importance of active peacekeepers in helping to implement compromise settlements. Between 1940 and 2002, if peacekeepers were present on the ground, settlements were implemented and civil wars ended. If peacekeepers were not present, they were not.

Notably absent from her article are any references to what Iraqis want.

What happens in Iraq is, apparently, still entirely an American responsibility. Iraqi opinion? Not relevant.

Eric: "Not sure there are enough private soldiers available (and they don't have the hardware),"

I'm not at all sure of the first point: it depends on what mission you intend to task them with, and there are an awful lot of ex-soldiers floating around the world.

And on the second point, the world is awash in spare arms and the arms trade, up to and including full-blown battle tanks, so I'm really skeptical of that assertion.

I'm not at all sure of the first point: it depends on what mission you intend to task them with, and there are an awful lot of ex-soldiers floating around the world.

As in...who's paying all these private forces?

Does the third party showing in Kurdistan recently change the dynamics appreciably? Presumably a weakened Kurd leadership might be more likely to discuss compromise, esp. regarding oil revenue.

"A country that has experienced one civil war is much more likely to experience a second and third civil war."

Ahh, so that's why the UN keeps sending those pesky black helicopters to fly over my house. Having already experienced one civil war (two if you count the Revolutionary War), the USA is obviously an at-risk state for another civil war.


That's partly because violence tends to exacerbate the political, economic and social problems that caused war to break out in the first place. But it is also because the first civil war often ends with no clear victor and no enforceable peace settlement. As soon as the combatants have rested and resupplied, strong incentives exist to try to recapture the state. [...]"

Compromise of 1877?
Rise of the KKK?
The Civil Rights struggle during the 20th Cen.?
The Southern Strategy?

Seems to me that the US is on solid ground in giving advice to Iraqis about how to manage the inconclusive, messy, and long drawn out aftermath following in the wake of a civil war. At least this is one area where we have lots of experience to draw upon.

Recall, the Surge was supposed to create space for the various warring factions to forge a lasting political reconciliation.

It might have worked. I haven't heard McCain slanging Romney, or vice versa recently, and General Petraeus' name is bandied about as a potential '12 candidate as well, and the last supplemental for Iraq sailed through Congress.

Oh, you mean the Surge was about political reconciliation in Iraq....

I'm not at all sure of the first point: it depends on what mission you intend to task them with, and there are an awful lot of ex-soldiers floating around the world.

And on the second point, the world is awash in spare arms and the arms trade, up to and including full-blown battle tanks, so I'm really skeptical of that assertion

My point being, all the existing merc outfits would have a very hard time fielding and maintaining 50,000 troops. While the arms might be out there, it would be truly radical for the US govt to greenlight a mercenary army equipping itself with serious hardware like that. A few flying vehicles and some light armor is one thing (Blackwater). But to give them the go ahead to purchase tanks and other heavy arms? That's a hell of a leap, and I'm HIGHLY skeptical that the Obama admin or even Bush admin would OK such a development.

That was one of the checks put on the capacity of Blackwater and other such outfits.

When I was in Iraq, private security firms were restricted to 7.62 or smaller rounds. Some of the more reputable firms would not even ride in Army vehicles that were armed above that just to be sure that they were not violating the restriction (presumably worried about photos or something that might indicate they were the people with the weapons).

On the otherhand, there are private firms that train foreign armies to use heavier weapons, like tanks and artillery. It is not that big a jump for firms to employ the weapons they are already training people to use.

And the private firms used a lot of people from Peru, Uganda, Fiji, etc., so it would not be hard to come up with 50,000 troops.

I guess for some people, the dream never dies -- the "dream" in this case being the arrogant assumption of the USA as the "indispensable nation", without whose wise and disinterested counsel (not to mention the airstrikes, UAV attacks and midnight raids) the "backward peoples of the world" will inevitably come to grief, as they are simply incapable of self-governance, and might be so forever, without having our sterling example stuck in their faces to Suck.On.This for a few decades. White Man's Burden, an all that.

I hate to bring it up, but our presence there has long been exposed as being an invasion which was based on lies, our occupation of their country an act of unprovoked aggression: the very definition of a war crime.

We need to get out now, all the way out, while we still can. We do not need to leave a few thousand troops hanging around as sitting ducks, and a tripwire to full involvement all over again, whenever the "sectarian civil war" situation goes ballistic -- which it will. Too bad about the 4000+ American and 1 million+ Iraqui casualties this clusterf**k has cost; send that bill to Dallax, TX -- by way of The Hague.

"My point being, all the existing merc outfits would have a very hard time fielding and maintaining 50,000 troops."

I was thinking that anyone not enlisted in a national army counted as "private troops."

Which is to say, among those already numerous in Iraq, are the "Sons of Iraq," the Shiite militia, the peshmerga, and Sunni jihadis, as well as still fighting Ba'athists, and, of course, Sadrists. Let alone foreigners willing to come for Islamist reasons, let alone people who just want a paycheck, and aren't fussy about who pays them.

But, to be sure, Nell wasn't at all clear as to what she was referring to when she first brought "Have seen references to Obama admin proposals for private military to be stationed in Iraq for all eternity" into the conversation, and not all the folks I've mentioned would be, I think, "greenlighted" by the Obama administration. Peshmerga and "Sons of Iraq," though, we have history with.

And general, "neutral," what we commonly consider "mercenaries," whether for Big Corporations like Blackwater, or individuals for higher, are quite numerous.

Of course, if it's the Iraqi government we're talking about, maybe they can hire Gurkhas, or get the French Foreign Legion on their side, or get the Saudis to pay the Pakistanis for some troops. Etc. Lots of poor countries do good business sending out troops in return for nice compensation. During the "Blackhawk Down" "incident," Pakistani and Malaysian troops played a major role. (The general view of most of the American troops was that they were not impressed with the enthusiasm of these other troops, but differing points of view on such matters are common.)

"And the private firms used a lot of people from Peru, Uganda, Fiji, etc., so it would not be hard to come up with 50,000 troops."

Yep. The world over, poor people join the military, and then leave. But with a skill! And a need for a job.

But if we're talking organized and private, why, DynCorp alone reportedly has 16,800 employees. Xe Services LLC, formerly "Blackwater," "trains more than 40,000 people a year," every year!

They also make their own drones, their own Armored Personnel Carriers, their own naval training facilities and ships, and their own air force airlines!

[...] In March 2006, Cofer Black, vice chairman of Blackwater USA, allegedly suggested at an international conference in Amman, Jordan, that the company was ready to move towards providing security professionals up to brigade size (3,000–5,000) for humanitarian efforts and low-intensity conflicts. [...] The company denies this was ever said.[162]

The U.S. needs to decide what outcome it is willing to live with in Iraq.
OK. So does that mean Britain has to decide what outcome it is willing to live with in India? And the Russians get to decide what outcome they can "live with" in the Czech Republic?

They also make their own drones, their own Armored Personnel Carriers, their own naval training facilities and ships, and their own airlines!

Yeah, but that's not enough.

And the Russians get to decide what outcome they can "live with" in the Czech Republic?

And Mexico decides what outcome it can live with in Texas.

I can dream, can't I?

I brought up the merc-force-to-stay-forever trial balloon only to illustrate my state of mind. If I had more confidence in this admin, I'd have followed the link, researched it, saved it, etc., sure that it either wasn't as bad as the headline sounded or was someone pushing an agenda that could be stopped.

Now, with preventive detention on the horizion, and Kris/Johnson testimony clearly pointing to abandoning criminal justice system in favor of "legalizing" a new manufactured multi-level set of show trials, while Gen. Westmoreland,uh, McChrystal asks for more troops to escalate in Afghanistan (which Eric's more recent post addresses), I no longer have any confidence that any plan attributed to ObamaCo is too outlandish, too at odds with what people thought they were getting.

On the Maliki electioneering front, here's what the people have to look forward to:

Baghdad blast walls to come down

On the Maliki electioneering front, here's what the people have to look forward to:

Baghdad blast walls to come down

I'd like to optimistically hope that's good news; at the least, all the necessary ethnic cleansing has long been accomplished, hasn't it? Or am I being too optimistic?

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