I will stand by my assessment

by von

She might be inspired or she might be insane .... what's that?  Ohh, sorry: inspired just left the building. 

Or:  Don't blog about marrying one of your commentators and expect no commentary.

This is a mid-week open thread.  There is one rule:  Do not feed the troll.  That is, no talking about The Notorious A.L.T. (or her spouse) (prospective). 

You may, however, buy the happy couple a shubbery.  But make it tasteful!  No fir trees that you have trained over the course of decades to look like a giant penis.  I don't care how long you spent getting the veins right; It just isn't an appropriate wedding gift.  And no bushes shaped like labia nor other lady parts neither.*  We are equal-opportunity prudes here at ObWi. 

UPDATE:  I just stumbled across the following (re)interpretation of "Little Red Riding Hood."  It is both off-topic and -- disturbingly -- on.  Enjoy.  I think.

Slagsmålsklubben - Sponsored by destiny from Tomas Nilsson on Vimeo.

*You didn't think I read Feministe, didja? No worries: Y'know I just read it to improve my game, lay-deez.   

Comments

[von]

Fitting, of course, for this to be posted on April Fools Day.

[Warren Terra]

Given the referenced Notorious one, there is an issue with your gift-giving advice: whatever she encounters, she is liable to see hidden meanings no-one else can see, even meanings that no-one else can see after the meanings have been pointed out. Indeed, there have been several, ah, notorious episodes of this sort. Just ask Jessica Valenti, for one early and famous example.

Obviously, this means that your advice is completely incorrect: a gift that to any reasonable person seems innocuous and inoffensive could easily contain explicit subtexts visible to the notorious person (and only to her). I recommend that an item of the utmost anatomical explicitness be gifted, to see whether the same principle works in reverse, and she is able only to perceive its complete lack of similarity to anything naughty.

[wonkiemycatlilycharliewrenjimmyskyetc]

I thought April fool's Day was tomorrow.

[lightning]

Warren Terra --

Good idea. I'd suggenst something like this. (NSFW. Cover bird cages and fishbowls. Move hot food & beverages to another room. Breathe deeply and visualize Schenectady.)

[evil_fizz]

She might be inspired or she might be insane .... what's that? Ohh, sorry: inspired just left the building.

Were you not here during the great http://obsidianwings.blogs.com/obsidian_wings/2007/06/carrot_sticks_a.html>the onion ring symbolizes the vagina lunacy? Inspired was never an option.

[OCSteve]

Jeeze – don’t link her you’ll just encourage her…

[russell]

I like her new haircut.

[Gary Farber]

"Or: Don't blog about marrying one of your commentators and expect no commentary."

I'm inclined to think that if one doesn't read Althouse, and lacks context, that linked post is more or less incomprehensible. Who is she quoting? What's it about? Why should I care?

At least, it's incomprehensible, lacking context, for me. I have no idea what she's talking about, and no idea why you've linked to it, and as a result, I find your post pretty much incomprehensible, too, I'm afraid.

I have no idea who "The Notorious A.L.T." is (Ann Althouse? But those aren't her initials). Nor who "(or her spouse)" is, nor what "(prospective)" means. (She's getting married? Why should I care? Why would I want to know? Let alone why would I want to be warned not to comment about someone you're posting about? I don't understand how this makes sense: you're posting to tell us not to talk about something a reasonable number of us know nothing about and don't care about? Wtf?)

[cleek]

I have no idea who "The Notorious A.L.T." is (Ann Althouse? But those aren't her initials)

it's a play on "The Notorious B.I.G.". "B.I.G." weren't Christopher Wallace's initials either. they were just the first three letters of one of his other nicknames: "Biggie Smalls".

[cleek]

congratulations to Ted Stevens for escaping the clutches of justice and giving the Bush DOJ yet another way to embarrass our country.

[cleek]

sozialversicherungspflichtige !

[Anderson]

she is liable to see hidden meanings no-one else can see, even meanings that no-one else can see after the meanings have been pointed out

IOW, "dumb as a brick."

But I had always thought that the flattery in AA's threads was only explicable as a contest of suitors.

[wonkiemycatlilycharliewrenjimmyskyetc]

That's the bizarre thing about her threads. Why do those people worship her? Are there people out there who are drawn to those who have narcissic personality disorder?

I remember a phenomenon like the Althouse blog from high school. We had a new teacher who thought he was the coolest thing ever. He walked like the coolesst thing and held his head like thhe coolest thing and had this tone of voice like thhe coolest things so that one could almost believe he was the coolest thing except that he kind of made the hair on the back of my neck stand on end.

Anyway he had groupies who thought hhe was the coolest thing, too. Mostly girl student groupies but some teachers. Collectively they made one of those high school in-crowds that seem to exist mostly for the purpose of identity-by-exclusion: you aren't one of us if you don't eat lunchh in Mr. Cool's room! Fortunatley for me I had a crowd of my own and no temptation to join his.

Because the hair-standing-up-on-my-neck instinct turned out to be right: he ws an exploiter, simultaneously having affairs with teachers and students.

[Catsy]

Althouse is an idiot. Let's get that out of the way.

But Sullivan and the others tee-heeing over her marrying one of her commenters--a person she notes she's been talking with for 4 years--are acting like a bunch of short-bus Heathers. "Internet user meets spouse on the Internet" hasn't been cutting-edge news for about 15 years.

[Gary Farber]

"But Sullivan and the others tee-heeing over her marrying one of her commenters"

Oh, that's part of what it is? I know Von said it generically, but there was nothing whatever about such a thing in the post he linked to, so it didn't make any sense to me.

I met the woman who was my girlfriend for the better part of the last year, until recent months, over the internet.

[cleek]

i met my wife on-line. though this was well before there was such a thing as the WWW.

we used VMS Notes, and we liked it.

[russell]

Are there people out there who are drawn to those who have narcissic personality disorder?

Yes.

[Eric Martin]

Speaking of meeting my wife, I just finished the purchase of an engagement ring this morning.

The, gulp, moment of truth is nigh.

[von]

it's a play on "The Notorious B.I.G.". "B.I.G." weren't Christopher Wallace's initials either. they were just the first three letters of one of his other nicknames: "Biggie Smalls".

Thanks, Cleek. Y'know, I work hard filling these stupid little posts with relatively obscure references. It's nice to be appreciated.... or, at least, understood.

[Hogan]

Best of luck, Eric. Let us know if you need letters of recommendation.

[von]

Eric, wonderful news! Equally inspiring is the fact that your wife-to-be apparently has a life, such that you're confident that she won't read about the upcoming proposal on this here blog!

[wonkiemycatlilycharliewrenjimmyskyetc]

Congratulations Eric and prospective Mrs. Eric!

I met my husband through the personal ads in the Seattle Weekly. Where else was I going to meet a man? I don't go to church or bars.

[DecidedFenceSitter]

Thankfully I've always met my partners through friends. It is easier when they do the initial vetting process for me.

Good luck Mr. Martin.

[publius]

good luck e-diddy!

[publius]

i take she's not a regular commenter

[Hob]

I have a friend who met his sweetheart on the Internet... because he looked up her name after he found it in a used paperback that she'd scribbled notes in. Best of both worlds.

My own sweetie, I met face to face in a salacious context involving cake, although the cake itself was not salacious.

And Gary, I'm sorry to hear things have gone badly. Standard useless sympathetic remark.

[Ugh]

The, gulp, moment of truth is nigh.

Make sure to bring a bottle of champagne, and good luck!

[russell]

mazel tov Eric!

My own sweetie, I met face to face in a salacious context involving cake

There's a tale to be told in that one!

[cleek]

Eric: congrat, congrat, congrat.

[Gary Farber]

That's fantastic, Eric. All best wishes!

[tgirsch]

I met my wife at my ex-girlfriend's birthday party. I was at said party with a date, who was neither the ex-girlfriend whose party it was, nor my now-wife.

[Gary Farber]

"And Gary, I'm sorry to hear things have gone badly. Standard useless sympathetic remark."

Somewhat more on recent badness here. (Um, any subscriptions at my blog taken out would be immensely appreciated and tremendously useful, if not life-saving, even more than any immediate donations. Any combination of $5 and up can be done!)

On the positive front, my renewed SSI application for disability is proceeding, with new forms practically every day. And although the therapist I've been seeing the last 7 months left the agency a couple of weeks ago, my first session with new therapist earlier today went about as well as it could. Very annoying about having to switch, though; I really liked him.

And I've got a bunch of official diagnoses for my various mental, as well as physical, ailments (Major Chronic Depression, bipolar, agoraphobia, major anxiety and panic disorders, etc., etc.).

Too bad he had to cross two "positive factors" out of four off my diagnosis form ("sympathetic girlfriend" and "stable living environment") but so it goes.

Anyway, not to distract from Eric's great news! Sorry for talking about myself so much! May everything go wonderfully, Eric!

[von]

Gary, best of luck. I have some experience with bipolar disorders -- not personal, thankfully -- and know how they can really be a pain. (To put it mildly.)

[Gary Farber]

Thanks, von. I wouldn't wish my life, my situation, or the way I typically feel, on my worst enemy.

I'm sorry that sometimes my frustration with my life comes out in excessive snark, sarcasm, or crankiness here. ObWi is one of, if not the, only links I have these days to other people, and hanging onto some sanity.

Sad, but true.

[Eric Martin]

such that you're confident that she won't read about the upcoming proposal on this here blog

No siree, not worried about that. She uses the intertubes for more serious matters, like shopping, email-based communication and making travel plans.

Lately, apartment/home shopping.

Not to maker her sound frivolous - which she isn't. Just not into blogs.

As for the moment of truth, now that I've abused my credit card like a pile of methamphetamine in order to get the damned ring, I'm trying to figure out how to go about it:

Don't want to be cheesy and cliched, but that requires originality and imagineering.

Anyway, not to distract from Eric's great news! Sorry for talking about myself so much! May everything go wonderfully, Eric!

As I've said before, you're my homey. No worries ever.

[Slartibartfast]

The, gulp, moment of truth is nigh.

I advise going with the flow. I had purchased my ring with cash, which I had rather more of at the time than at present, and it was parked in my pants pocket. I figured: we're going to a wedding and reception; surely there will be an opportunity, there. Well, no. Basically the bridesmaids were collectively drunk and highly disorderly, and the music at the reception was more dorm-stereo-battle than wedding-reception in nature. So we exited after some graceful period, and drove back toward home.

Then inspiration hit. I said: hey, why don't we have dinner at XXXXXX's, which happened to be the site of our first date. Great food, neat atmosphere. It felt right. So I ordered a bottle of champagne with dinner, pretext being that we didn't get any at the reception, and the groundwork was laid. S.O. accepted, the waitress cried, and was so emotional that she recorded the particulars of the event (down to the table number) on our menu, and gave the menu to us when we left.

Everybody was happy, including me.

OT note: in protest against the diamond industry, I picked a large-ish Ceylon sapphire and designed a ring around it, including some more modestly sized diamonds. It wound up costing me about as much as a diamond would have, partially because I was worried about the marquis setting and had them make it out of platinum for strength.

But it's one of a kind, and beautiful.

[Eric Martin]

OT note: in protest against the diamond industry, I picked a large-ish Ceylon sapphire and designed a ring around it, including some more modestly sized diamonds. It wound up costing me about as much as a diamond would have, partially because I was worried about the marquis setting and had them make it out of platinum for strength.

But it's one of a kind, and beautiful.

My girl, she don't like diamonds. Emeralds are her thing. So, like you, I picked an alternative: a large-ish Colombian emerald (one of the cleaner ones I found, and a nice blue-green color). I Designed a ring around it also, with .70 ct worth of little diamonds on a platinum band.

It sure wasn't cheap, but I feel like you do: one of a kind, personal, beautiful.

[jrudkis]

I think it is considered very romantic to lead into it with a prenuptial agreement. It really shows the type of economic conservatism so in vogue today. Plus, it might make her think you actually have something of value that you need to protect, making you that much better of a "catch."

[Eric Martin]

duly noted jrudkis...;)

[wonkiemycatlilycharliewrenjimmyskyetc]

((Hugs,Gary)))

Not knowing yur honey, I can't speculate on timing your proposal. Pauls' proposal to me came five years after we bought a house together during a discsion of our post-retirement economic situation. i pointed out that i would no longer get my health insurance through my union. He suggested that i go on his. Turns out that we either had to be domestic partners of the same gender or get married.

The rig acqusition was romantic, howver. While window shopping in a tourist town in Ireland we discovered that there were local craftspeople who made gold rings. So we commissioned a pair of wedding rings in a celtic knot design.

[Gary Farber]

"...out how to go about it:
Don't want to be cheesy and cliched, but that requires originality and imagineering."

Not knowing anything about her, my only suggestion would be to try, as a starting point, thinking about the things she particularly likes or loves, or some special personal interest, or hobby, she has, and try to think of some way that connects to, or could grow out of, or be placed into, one of those things. Perhaps.

So that whatever the method you chose, it might be, in fact, somewhat original to, or at least personally oriented to, her. This is doubtless rather obvious advice, so offered for what little it's worth.

If it's not in some special way, I'd otherwise suggest, also obviously, in some particularly beloved location (these two thoughts can possibly be combined).

[Eric Martin]

Thanks. I mean, that's the ultimate point, but it helps to hear it spelled out.

[Jay C]

Best of luck, Eric. Let us know if you need letters of recommendation.

Or at least positive comments! Your brainwashed trolletariat legion of admiring fans will get right on it!

Seriously, mazel tov!

[liberal japonicus]

My engagement ring was my grandmother's wedding ring, and I was going to ask when my one and only came to the states to see me, and so I picked her up at the airport and we got back to my place and I asked if there was anything she wanted to do and she said she'd like to get married and I said, well, funny you should mention it...

Now, she says that I didn't ask her and I reply that if she hadn't been such a smartass, she would have gotten the question followed by discussions of my courage. So my advice, don't get cute, no matter what juicy opening pops up, the momentary creativeness is not worth the now 15+ years of having to defend yerself.

[Jeff]

I'm sorry that sometimes my frustration with my life comes out in excessive snark, sarcasm, or crankiness here.

I feel like your post above is one such example, especially crankiness. To that end, I'll not say more about it.

========================

It's nice to be appreciated.... or, at least, understood.

I got the reference as well, so that makes at least 2!

[Jeff]

Oh, and the video: full of win. Must be watched at full-screen to be fully appreciated. (Who knew that grandmothers were so fattening?!)

[Bernard Yomtov]

Mazel tov, Eric.

[Von]

Gary, I am on record in private, so let's make it public:

Although you sometimes drive me nuts, I can't imagine ObWi without you...
Though the nuts bit sometimes makes me wish I could!

Hmmmm: it's possible I just proposed to you. (love is in the air, baby!) It'll be hard on the miss, but so long as we register at West Elm, I am sure we'll make it through.

[Gary Farber]

Aw, that's sweet, Von. Thanks.

I have to warn you that it turns out I'm very high maintenance, though.

And you're hardly the first or only person I drive nuts. (Including myself, woo-hoo!)

[Turbulence]

I ended up doing something similar to Slarti. My wife hates the diamond industry, so I went with a sapphire from Indonesia in a semi-custom platinum setting (with no other stones). The setting is cool because you can see the whole ring from the bottom and from the sides (look ma, no prongs).

As for proposing, I would only suggest that if you decide to do it while hiking, be sure to check out the trail difficulty yourself, rather than relying entirely on her suggestion. Otherwise you'll get an exhausted over-exterted fiancee saying yes while hovering near heatstroke territory. Also, beware of trails that have the phrase "billy goat" in their name. I'm sure this advice will be readily applicable to your situation.

Oh, and congratulations!

[JanieM]

Eric -- congrats to both of you!

[Von]

By the way Eric:

For yr better half, get the best you can afford.

For you, go white gold. Relatively cheap. Lightweight. Allows you to master the "wild magic," as the kids may say, should you unintentionally Fail to be true (unbeliever) when you accidentally slip into The Land. Cause you never know, y'know?

Also, pause for a moment when you give your vow to remember those who, by quirk of desire and jurisdiction, cannot marry the one they love.

Did I mention gold is cheap? Seriously, you'll feel better when you lose you ring for a too long moment at the blackjack table at the Palms. Not that this ever happened to me, of course.

[JanieM]

von: Also, pause for a moment when you give your vow to remember those who, by quirk of desire and jurisdiction, cannot marry the one they love.

Hey von, thanks for that.

[Gary Farber]

"Cause you never know, y'know?"

Oh, lord, Stephen Donaldson.

You kids.

[russell]

The first "commitment"-y thing my wife and I did together was buy cemetery plots. There's a back story to that, but those are the facts.

We didn't get married for almost another ten years, but the end game was never in question after that.

When I bought my wife's diamond I knew she would want to design her own setting, so I just bought the stone. When I picked it up, the folks I bought it from offered to set it.

I said, "No, I'll just take the stone".

They said, "Trust us, she'll want to put it on".

They were right. They set it in a very simple, inexpensive setting, which was soon replaced by a setting of my wife's design, but she wore it every day until her own setting was ready.

I never really expected to get married, but it was, hands down, the best thing I've ever done.

Good luck, Eric!

[John Spragge]

I promised myself that at the next open thread I'd post these. In one of the threads a while back, OCSteve mentioned that his sister likes dogs. So I thought maybe he (or she) would like these pictures of a very cute little dog. These are pictures of a young fawn pug.

Click here, here, and here.

Enjoy...

[wonkie]

Whose adorable puggie is that?

I used to have a big fat old pug. Charlie was the love of my life.

What is that strange structure in the background of the first picure? It looks like a baby gate rapped in bandage gauze.

And how do you get pictures posted here? I've tried unsucessfully a couple of times.

[Eric Martin]

Thanks to everyone.

And Von: Hilarious about the Palms. And the proposal.

[von]

Oh, I've nearly lost my ring everywhere. I can't type with it on, so it's always sitting under a stack of papers on my desk somewhere. Or my floor: my tradition, when working on a brief, is to toss prior drafts and other used-up stuff on the floor. The ring sometimes gets tossed too. When I used to work on a high floor in the Sears tower, I dropped my ring between the desk and the plate-glass window and couldn't find it for almost a week. (I finally found it when I was searching around for something else and saw the ring reflected in the glass.) I've rolled rings down at least a half-dozen airplane aisles. I've seen my ring spiral off bar stools. I've dropped my ring in pretty much every social setting, much to my wife's annoyance.

Still, I've never permanently lost it .... and it will be 10 years this April 29. Since, IIRC, it cost $250, that's a pretty good ROI.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

Congratulations, Eric. I hope she is prepared for plenty of fall and winter Sundays of Raiders football.

It took five seasons, this past one, before my wife seemed to come with some kind of acceptance for my love of NFL football and how her husband could sit through one game and want to watch another one right after. (I think Olga thinks halftime signals the end, not an intermission, no matter how many times I have told her.)

---

Did anyone see Rachel Maddow's interview with Colin Powell last night?

She kept trying to pin him down on who knew what in the Bush Administration regarding torture and he kept tapdancing, looking extremely uncomfortable. Ultimately, Powell would not offer anything substantive because he said it was a "legal matter."

I give Powell props for going on Maddow's show but could not help but wonder if he realized he wasn't going on "Larry King."

[Eric Martin]

Congratulations, Eric. I hope she is prepared for plenty of fall and winter Sundays of Raiders football.

She long ago gave up that fight.

Quote: "I hope my funeral's not on a Sunday, because I know you won't be there."

Smartest move I've made to date: Getting her involved in the weekly pool. Give her a dog in the fight, and she's competitive enough to...at least tolerate me watching religiously ;)

Actually, some of my best Raider gear has come from her. I'm such a dork.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

Eric: Olga has lightened up on me watching so much football after she found out some of her Russian friends would get as whipped into a frenzy as I during the playoffs, etc. (I've met a lot of immigrants who take to football much faster than baseball, which seems to bore most foreigners to tears -- of course, it does that to some Americans.)

A quick note: I guess you've heard by now that the Broncos traded QB Jay Cutler to the Bears for, among other things, two No. 1 draft picks. Cutler could be just what the doctor ordered for quarterback-starved Chicago. Meanwhile, I would not be surprised if Denver falls into the AFC West basement: no defense, now no offense, not a pretty combination.

[hilzoy]

Yo Eric! Great!

The thing about proposing is: if it's heartfelt, you really can't go wrong. If you're totally besotted with her and want to spend the rest of your life with her, and you actually tell her so, the rest doesn't matter so much.

[Gary Farber]

"The thing about proposing is: if it's heartfelt, you really can't go wrong."

Actually, if you just met the person yesterday....

[hilzoy]

Gary: true enough. Add: supposing that proposing isn't completely ludicrous to start with ...

[Slartibartfast]

Oh, I've nearly lost my ring everywhere.

I've lost my ring(s?) quite a few times. My first & original wedding ring...well, we have a picture of it. My mother-in-law cooked up a whole mess of blue crab, and it was my first time, so I took the wedding ring off and put it nearby, on the many layers of newspaper that were placed on the table for reasons I was to discover soon.

We have pictures of it, sitting right next to a pile of cleaned-out crabshells. MIL quickly bundled up the leavings and tossed them out, and I was too much in food coma to notice that out went the ring with the leavings.

Second ring was lost in a hotel room on the night that Florida beat Tennessee at home en route to their first national championship.

Third ring...third one I bought in a jewelry shop in Old Mesilla (Las Cruces) for maybe $5. Ok, it might have been $10 or even $15. Silver, with turquoise inlays. I've since lost that one, found it again, lost it again, found it, lost it...I bought rings four and five at a jewelry store on Green Mesa; both silver. I've still got both of those, too.

Maybe I'm getting good at this. Ask me in another decade. Or, it could be the first two were gold and I turned out to be a more silver kind of guy.

[jrudkis]

The best solution on male rings is to simply tell your wife that due to the complex and dangerous machinery you work with, it is simply a safety hazard to wear.

That way, she will never know you lost trying to draw to a straight.

[John Spragge]

wonkie: The pug belongs to my kid.

How I uploaded: I used Picassa, a free web photo album service provided by Google. You can get in using a gmail or blogger account.

Upload the picture, go to the album, select the link to this photo option from the right hand side, and copy the link into an anchor. It will look like <a href="http://picasaweb.google.ca/lh/photo/Yt8JSczVfME_W12kJpOPUw?feat=directlink"> this </a> when you edit it, and like this when it displays.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

I guess we've all lost all rings, so I'll join in.

I've lost mine just once in five years, our first winter married, and the last that we had substantial snow here in Newark, Del. I was shoveling to the point where I lost track of time and I did not realize how shriveled up my fingers had gotten -- so the ring must have slipped off. I noticed its absence when I was inside resting and panic set in. But our young son came in and, somehow, found it right away on the sidewalk.

I know and meet a great number of men who don't wear a wedding ring. I've grown to feel naked without mine.

---

Pugs always seem to be characters. My favorite Pug was "Frank" in the original "Men in Black," one of the best things about the movie.

[Eric Martin]

A quick note: I guess you've heard by now that the Broncos traded QB Jay Cutler to the Bears for, among other things, two No. 1 draft picks. Cutler could be just what the doctor ordered for quarterback-starved Chicago. Meanwhile, I would not be surprised if Denver falls into the AFC West basement: no defense, now no offense, not a pretty combination.

A few thoughts on this:

Chicago overpaid. Two first rounders and a third round pick for a fifth round pick swap. AND Kyle Orton. To me, that's too much.

IMO, Orton's not that bad a QB, and better than the QBs on most of the other teams in the hunt (Skins, Jets, Bucs). And now Orton's gonna have a beast of a wide receiver to throw to in Marshall, whereas Cutler's going to have to work with what is probably the worst receiving corp in the league. The Bears better draft him a top tier wide receiver or he's gonna be mighty unhappy.

Obviously I have visceral hatred for the Broncos, so it upsets me that they did so well in this swap. Glad Cutler's gone, but they got a nice consolation package. Too nice.

[Jesurgislac]

Congratulations, Eric.

von: Also, pause for a moment when you give your vow to remember those who, by quirk of desire and jurisdiction, cannot marry the one they love.

What's really cool is when the officiant pauses the ceremony to ask for a moment's silence for (as the Unitarian pastor put it the one time I was sitting in the congregation) "our lesbian and gay brothers and sisters". That was really nice, and timed particularly well - although the couple getting married were good friends and I had traveled a long way to be there (and wanted to be there) I had been, momentarily, feeling a little angst as the pastor talked about the importance and significance of marriage... and it just went, with that comment, and the inclusion of everyone there in collective goodwill.

My favorite Pug was "Frank" in the original "Men in Black," one of the best things about the movie.

Tommy Lee Jones getting eaten by a giant cockroach! That was pretty good, too...

[Eric Martin]

Thanks Jes. BTW: I'll probably get married in a Unitarian church for precisely those reasons (and others).

[bedtimeforbonzo]

Eric: When I got home last night and watched "NFL Live," the analysts -- Trent Dilfer and Mark Schlereth -- convinced me that the Bears overpaid for Cutler. I think it really boils down to whether Cutler becomes a franchise quarterback for a decade and that is very much up in the air. (Year 1 could be a disaster if Devin Hester is still their No. 1 receiver.)

Cutler was one of the reasons I was surprised Denver fired Mike Shanahan -- it seemed like the offensive guru had John Elway's replacement clicking in that offense.

I saw Orton look great and awful -- sometimes in the same games -- and wonder if he can take to those AFC West shootouts without becoming interception-prone.

---

Jes: I liked "Men in Black's" conceit that there are aliens among us, Michael Jackson being an obvious example.

Switching gears: I saw Part 2 of that Powell-Maddow interview last night and, reading between the lines, he indicated that Don't Ask, Don't Tell had run its course and should be overturned.

[Panic disorders]

There are many factors that contribute to this and the most common is that people are different in various aspects.