Almost Like The Nazis, Except For, Well, Everything ...

by hilzoy

Via Media Matters, Michael Savage:

"The fact of the matter is that Obama may be getting ready to organize his own personal army not of brown shirts but of green shirts. And that is why he has given this street thug Van Jones -- in my opinion a street thug, a man who has specialized in harassing the police themselves -- this all-important job. If Obama should appoint thousands, or more than thousands, of people to the environmental green czar to work for him, and then he deputizes them and then gives them guns, and then gives them federal powers over that of the local police, then you will know that we are repeating history in the United States of America.

You see, there was another man in another country who rose to power on an army of street thugs. And he had a friend named Ernst Romm who headed up an organization called the SA. The SA was a political army which protected the Nazi party leadership. It battled political opponents and terrorized the German people who opposed Hitler. Ernst Romm was an avowed socialist. He rejected capitalism. He pushed for the nationalization of German industry and the redistribution of wealth. It seems that the Obama appointees actually have almost the same exact policies as the Nazi Party did. 

What you don't know is that the environment, in this case, is being used by the Obama administration in an attempt to gain control of the US population. The brownshirts, as I said, under Hitler, were used to intimidate Germans who opposed Hitler. My fear is that Obama will be using the greenshirts, these street agitators, in order to control the police and the people.

Now you're not able to talk about this because you don't know who I'm talking about, because the vermin in the media are covering up this very dangerous situation that is going on right in front of your nose."

If any President took some federal bureaucracy -- the US Geological Survey, say, or the Bureau of Engraving and Printing, or the Agricultural Marketing Service -- and gave them guns and federal power over the police and the people, and used it as his own private army, that would be scary! I'm not sure why people hired to weatherize buildings or construct a smart grid would be more likely to be transformed into such an army than the other bureaucracies I mentioned, but it's still a sobering thought. But there are a few tiny problems:

(1) It would be illegal.

(2) There is no indication whatsoever that Obama plans to do any such thing.

(3) Jones' job in the Obama administration doesn't involve control over any large agency.

(4) If he did want to create a private army, he'd have a hard time using people who get green jobs under the stimulus package, since they will probably mostly be private contractors.

But if Obama did create a private army under Van Jones, despite his having given no indication whatsoever of doing this, and despite Van Jones' job not having any such powers, and if the courts and the Congress somehow acquiesced in this flagrant illegality, that would be pretty awful! And if, in addition, he started a global war of aggression, opened concentration camps, and committed genocide, then he'd "have almost the same exact policies as the Nazi Party did."

Likewise, if Michael Savage were to take over the US, send its urban population to do forced labor on collective farms, confiscate private property, abolish money, and create a massive famine that killed at least one eighth of the population, he'd be a lot like Pol Pot. And if he had wheels, he'd be a trolleycar.

Obama possibly being a Nazi, Michael Savage possibly being Pol Pot, the horrifying specter of human/trolleycar hybrids: it's a scary, scary world we live in!

Or, you know, maybe not.

***

PS: Anyone want to argue that Savage would have called Van Jones a "street thug" if he weren't black?

Comments

[Andrew]

My fear is that Obama will be using the greenshirts, these street agitators, in order to control the police and the people.

Now you're not able to talk about this because you don't know who I'm talking about, because the vermin in the media are covering up this very dangerous situation that is going on right in front of your nose.

Does this guy seriously believe this stuff? Does anyone?

If so, this I honestly believe some professional therapy and medication is in order. Perhaps institutionalization.

If not, then this guy is the height of fear mongering knavery.
(Well, maybe not the height. There is some fierce competition out there.)

[ajrmacle]

Weren't the brownshirts Mussolini's thugs?

[UserGoogol]

ajrmacle: The Nazis had brownshirts, the Fascists had blackshirts.

[Guest]

what a hayseed

[bobbyp]

Michael Savage is, in the true sense of that famous phrase, not worth a warm pitcher of spit.

[Stefan]

Thanks for calling out that "street thug" reference, hilzoy. Talk about coded language...

[Warren Terra]

Gee, do you think Van Jones is worried about a repeat of The Night Of The Long Knives?

Actually, for me, the weird thing in the clip (other than the obvious one, of its Godwin-rich existence) was that Savage felt the need to explain that Hitler was an awful guy in that he palled around with someone who was allegedly a socialist. So that's the bad thing about Hitler. Maybe the thing to do is to tell Savage about The Night Of The Long Knives, and about how the Nazi party was actually very friendly to many wealthy industrialists and did not redistribute wealth to the masses; suppose that once all that is explained then Savage will realize that he's misjudged Hitler for all these years?

[Warren Terra]

bobbyp, I've always liked that phrase, but surely you're aware that:
(1) It was most famously used to describe the office of the Vice Presidency by an inhabitant of that office; it wasn't used to describe a person, and it wasn't used to say that something was repugnant, just that it was worthless. I realize that the phrase would work on its own terms, but given its history don't you think that the phrase seems a poor fit here?
(2) Although it's the version that appears in most history books, "spit" is a bowdlerization, and the actual quote apparently mentioned a different fluid the human body can produce copiously.

[Carleton Wu]

Im thinking that it would probably be a good idea in assembling a private street army to assemble them out of people who already know how to fight. Or have the inclination to fight. Or, at a minimum, signed up to fight (as opposed to planting trees or replacing incandescent light bulbs).
Im trying to understand how Michael Wiener sees liberals, that he thinks that any random selection of them can be handed guns and told to brutally suppress the public and they'll just go along with it. "I just signed up for this federal job weatherizing houses because the plant closed. Heck, I voted for McCain. But now that Ive got this green uniform on, I suddenly feel like roughing up some store owners and other scum capitalists."

[Ken Lovell]

When does he foresee Obamahitler deciding that Jonesrohm is no longer useful and shooting him after discovering him in bed with a boyfriend? That will happen in about 2011 I guess, when the Green Shirts threaten the authority of the fuhrer and it's time for Homeland Security to swear a personal oath of allegiance and take over in their spiffy new black uniforms.

Honestly, what would these fruitcakes do for argument if World War 2 had never happened? They'd be lost if they had to rely on stuff like evidence and logic.

[Warren Terra]

Im trying to understand how Michael Wiener sees liberals

If someone is imputing something to another without any obvious evidence, one good guess is always that it's because it's what they'd like to do themselves. In this case, Savage is, on the basis of nothing, suggesting that liberals want to form mobs and beat up conservatives; maybe Savage wants conservatives to form mobs and beat up liberals?

[KCinDC]

maybe Savage wants conservatives to form mobs and beat up liberals?

Well, he certainly seems to be working at it. No doubt if one of his listeners takes him at his word and follows through with what might be a reasonable reaction to the Obama threat as described, Savage will express disbelief that anyone could have gotten the idea of doing such a thing from his words.

[BlizzardOfOz]

Like the first comment, I really wonder about the audience for this kind of this. It's not like there is money, fame and power in it for them like for psychopaths-- sorry, "media personalities" like M.S. that lead them on. Is it that they're disenfranchised and they need extreme fantasy scenarios to justify their anger? Or is it more that they're just bored and enjoy the drama, as if it were a sort of daytime soap opera for wingnuts.

Also, it is infinitely depressing that our politics is dominated by toddlers.

[Awesom0]

Oh, the stupid, it BURNS!

[Hartmut]

I am surprised. Why did Whiner Savage forget to mention that Ernst Roehm was a winged mythical creature/bundle of sticks/inhabitant of a Dead Sea city? It's a gross neglicence to not emphasize teh sinister gay agenda behind all of it. When the green shirts (and the greenbucks) turn pink, it will be the sign that the takeover is complete.

[Joe]

There is a citation to "Michael Weiner" above. Michael Weiner is his past life, the one where he was NYC school teacher, hippie, herbal enthusiast etc. You know, a productive member of society, making the Bronx fairly proud.

"Michael Savage" is his current life, a character really, and to say what he "believes" as compared to what he "performs" might be misleading. Of course, it is very troubling that people take him seriously.

[kid bitzer]

i think the next step in the rhetorical sequence is pretty clear:

if you go along with plans to weatherize your own home,
then you're a neville chamberlain!!

i mean, he carried am umbrella, and everything!!

people who insulate their homes are all appeasers and defeatists,
in league with the green/brownshirts!!

and insulating contractors are fifth columnists!!

ah, the fun never stops.

[Slartibartfast]

I understand, maybe just a little, why the opinions of people like Michael Savage get your attention, hilzoy. But he's really not worth your time. The people who listen to him are, I think, not going to be listening to you.

[hilzoy]

Slarti: yeah, I wondered whether I should write it. There were two reasons why I did: one, there is some line of utter stupidity and vileness -- and it's pretty far out there -- that this crossed, and two, the first part of this that popped into my head when I wrote this was the part about the other federal agencies being used for this purpose. My first thought was: why not the Bureau of Weights and Measures?, but it turns out that its name changed a while back, so no good. But the general concept of agencies like the Bureau of Engraving and Printing being used as the US equivalent of brownshirts seemed very silly to me, so I succumbed.

[mattH]

Not sure why Savage himself does does it beyond a paycheck, but he's useful to the Republican party in that he opens the window a la Overton that allows the republicans to get away with making what are seemingly less radical accusations and making them seem more legitimate in response.

But I'm sure everyone here knows this.

[Slartibartfast]

There were two reasons why I did: one, there is some line of utter stupidity and vileness -- and it's pretty far out there -- that this crossed, and two, the first part of this that popped into my head when I wrote this was the part about the other federal agencies being used for this purpose.

That's more or less what I suspected, hilzoy. I actually listened to Michael Savage for a number of shows, but I had to stop because it quickly became obvious that the man is either crazy or is deliberately goading the crazies, or both.

And if you don't believe him, the Gay Mafia will make you sleep with the fishes.

[jonnybutter]

Anyone want to argue that Savage would have called Van Jones a "street thug" if he weren't black?

A rhetorical question. Black skin makes the Weiner shrivel a little extra.

I actually think it's important to keep an eye on someone like 'Savage'. He's not some little crank no one listens to. And he is, of course, the fascist he pretends to fear.

[bobbyp]

Warren,

Point taken.

1) Yes, I am aware Garner was referring to the office of the VP, not a person. Perhaps I should have stated "The lunatic ravings of Michael Savage are not....", but that gives the person too much credit.
2.) Forgot that. At my age the copiousness of said fluid is, er, not so much.

[now_what]

The people who listen to him are, I think, not going to be listening to you.

I doubt it is worth the effort to try to reason with the average Michael Savage fan. There are other things that can be done to respond to Savage. For example, people can stop paying his salary (by refusing to patronize his advertisers) if they don't appreciate the job he does.

But people aren't going to do that unless they know the kinds of things that he says.

[efgoldman]

@ now_what

But people aren't going to do that unless they know the kinds of things that he says.

Absolutely correct. After all, to use another Godwin, no-one in Weimar Germany took Hitler too seriously, either. Or at least, not enough someones who could get in his way later.

Absolutely, Savage is a nutcake talking to other nutcakes. Rush and Coulter make three. Still, its good for us to know the recipe for nutcake and to understand and locate the bakeries that sell it [to stretch a metaphor past the breaking point]. Also understand that if Coulter's book sales, or Rush's or Stevie's ratings tank, the media outlets that air and promote them will drop them more quyickly than the Marlins get rid of a free agent.

[vinceneilyoung]

As long as Michael Savage is stoking the paranoid fear of a private army, perhaps he could offer us his opinion of Blackwater.

[crazyJane]

Actually,

Comprised of nearly 200 highly-trained criminal investigators with full law enforcement authority, EPA’s criminal enforcement program was established in 1983 and is integral to the Agency’s overall enforcement work.

So, every president since Reagan has had his own private army of "greenshirts".

And yet, America survives.

[Slartibartfast]

As long as Michael Savage is stoking the paranoid fear of a private army, perhaps he could offer us his opinion of Blackwater.

Or covert teams of military assassins that don't report to anyone.

[Gary Farber]

"(1) It was most famously used to describe the office of the Vice Presidency by an inhabitant of that office; it wasn't used to describe a person"

Actually, it was "isn't worth a bucket of warm piss." The newspapers cleaned it up.

[Dave S.]

This is the kind of thing that Instapundit would link as "Disturbing, if true" and leave it at that.

Human/trolleycar hybrids would actually meet multiple economic and environmental goals so put me down as in favor.

[Johnny Pez]

Human/trolleycar hybrids would actually meet multiple economic and environmental goals so put me down as in favor.

And also they can be pressed into service to transport the government's green-shirted thugs when they get into their all-too-common street battles with the Chicago Teabaggers.