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August 15, 2008

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Thank you for picking up this angle. Attackerman has already pointed out that ABBA began recording five years after McCain was shot down, so it seems a little harsh to blame the North Vietnamese for his MOR musical preferences. (If his favorite song were Hanky Panky or Cherish, he might have a point.)

Hilzoy, for those of us either too young or too ignorant of popular culture to know (or, in my case, both), you might also include Ackerman's point that McCain's claim was, in addition to being another narrative-defying example of blatant non-reticence, also untrue, as McCain was a POW from October 1967 to March 1973, while Dancing Queen was released in 1975.

Heaven knows, I'm not going to criticize anyone's taste in music. But McCain is lying here, and transparently he's doing it in order to become the New Giuliani: where everything Giuliani said was a noun, a verb, and 9/11, soon everything McCain says will refer to his POW status.

The idea that this man might be president in less than six months is frightening.

Shooting war with Russia? Fnck yeah!

McCain was a POW from October 1967 to March 1973, while Dancing Queen was released in 1975.

McCain was into ABBA before they even released a single. in fact, he has a great collection of bootleg acetates of their first rehearsals from back when they were calling themselves BAB (before Agnetha Fältskog joined).

I don't want to be disloyal to the Democratic Party but this is one area where I overlook McCain's double-speak.

Yes, he has always said he is reluctant to talk about his POW experiences -- and in previous campaigns, he has. But in this one, he doesn't have much else.

I guess what I am inartfully trying to say is that anytime -- in any context -- McCain's POW experience is brought up, he wins.

One click on Hilzoy's first link -- that black-and-white shot of Sen. McCain as a handsome, young flyboy -- and I stopped clicking. Pictures like these are stronger than a million words, and this is the picture that the McCain camp wants Americans to remember when they go into the voting booth.

I guess what I am inartfully trying to say is that anytime -- in any context -- McCain's POW experience is brought up, he wins.

Five and a half years!!. it even beats infidelity.

BTW, with its "Dancing Queen" references, sorry if I took this post the wrong way -- or too seriously.

The idea that this man might be president in less than six months is frightening.
Shooting war with Russia? Fnck yeah!

Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice!

OK, I have a question about our proposed excellent adventure in the Caucasus (“We’re all Caucasians now!”).

SecDef Gates http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gQYe039zkquHxitiI6u4M_TRr_BAD92I7L580”>recently commented on the idea of us getting into a real shooting war with the Russians as a response to the Georgian crisis, and basically said:
meh, not so much.

So how does that square with McCain’s stance? Since McCain is now claiming cred for having been a Rumsfeld critic, shouldn’t he be ripping Gates as well?

Also, I liked this quote:

At the State Department, spokesman Robert Wood expressed concern over reports that Russia is deliberately sabotaging Georgian military infrastructure. "We are very concerned about these reports; it is a serious situation," Wood said.

That has to be one of the better euphemisms I’ve heard for blowing up anything of military value because in a future war it might be used against you “deliberately sabotaging military infrastructure”. The next time the US has to invade some other country, we might want to keep that one handy. We didn’t invade Iraq, we merely deliberately sabotaged their military infrastructure.

(“We’re all Caucasians now!”)
I hadn't even considered the racial angle!

That ABBA recorded well after McCain was shot down does not mean he was lying about when his tastes ossified, merely that his tastes are not terribly well-defined. To my ear, there is a sharp difference between the music of 1967 and the 70s sound of ABBA, but many people group all "oldies" together.

I'm not saying it's appropriate to drag one's war record into small talk about music, just that he was not also lying.

OT: Um, would I look like a total idiot if I admitted that I just realized, after months of seeing it, what "Warren Terra" is a play on? And I can't explain why that particular light bulb came on at this particular moment, but it did.

Crafty Trilobite -

Actually, the way I read it initially I thought that McCain was joking that his taste in music had been damaged by the surface-to-air missile. So it's not his fault that "Dancing Queen" is his favorite song because he's been brain damaged.

I've got to say, though, that for a guy who doesn't want to talk about his POW experience he certainly seems comfortable joking about it. Which is kind of weird - my dad "only" fought in the war and he doesn't joke about it much. He jokes sometimes about what some of his COs that were high all the time did (or at least I hope to the gods above that he's joking to some degree with those stories), but that's about it.

Six years of using the same internet pseudonym finally pay off ... although, the darn shame is of course that the dumb pseudonym is still relevant. People are still declaring that they will defeat an abstract noun, no matter what civil liberties, human rights, and national sovereignty need to be destroyed in the process.

Maybe it’s a conciliatory dog whistle to the Log Cabin People?
Back when I was a straight member in good standing (not a pun) of the gay community here Dancing Queen served as a sort of anthem, raising the energy on the dance floor perceptibly.
Or maybe he’s saving a special pair of fishnet stockings for the Oval Office.

cleek, McCain may have actually been into Abba when they were just B-for-Bjorn, when he was in a group called The Hootenanny Singers (or, over on this side of the ocean, as the Northern Lights). They released several singles in Europe in the mid-60s, and they even had a (quickly deleted) release in North America in 1967. I only know this because my father picked up the deleted vinyl in a Pierette's dépanneur in Montreal that year, and I still own it (and NO Abba!). Hey, he might even have seen one of their videos.

The idea that this man might be president in less than six months is frightening.

To me as well. OTOH, this post grates a little. I know what he means. I was out of the country for most of the 80’s. US 80’s culture is pretty foreign to me. And I was not a POW…

McCain may have actually been into Abba when they were just B-for-Bjorn, when he was in a group called The Hootenanny Singers (or, over on this side of the ocean, as the Northern Lights)

"The Hootenanny Singers"

wow. lookit all that. who knew!

McCain is old enough that i bet he was crazy about the bands B-for-Bjorn's dad was in !

:)

I only know this because my father picked up the deleted vinyl in a Pierette's dépanneur in Montreal that year, and I still own it (and NO Abba!)

that is a treasure.

i'd put it on a wall. no, really. i have a closet where all the walls are lined with 45's i've collected over the years. some of my most-prized recordings are held with thumbtacks on a wall of that closet.

of course... i don't actually know anything about ABBA, except what i looked up on Wiki so i could make that joke. i bet people don't realize how much effort i put into the nonsense i post here.

-cleek +750ml

US 80’s culture is pretty foreign to me.

I mean - big hair bands!?!? Where the hell did you people come up with that?

OCSteve: he's more than entitled to not know who was at the top of the charts when he was a POW. (Although if I were to nitpick, ABBA was formed several years after his release.) As far as I'm concerned, he's also more than entitled to talk about being a POW as much as he wants.

What provoked the post was having listened to him and others say, so often, that it's something he's very, very reluctant to talk about, and then having him drop it into the middle of a question about ABBA. (I should also say: I would not have written this post if this were the first time he had brought it up for no discernible reason, or if he had only said he were reluctant to talk about it maybe a thousand times, as opposed to a gazillion.)

And big hair bands: a total mystery.

I remember, back in the day, when I was living in Tucson and throwing newspapers for a living. (Note to readers: never, ever throw newspapers for a living unless you truly have no alternative.) I had a few extra dollars -- literally, maybe five that I had not expected to have and didn't already have spoken for -- and I didn't need e.g. shampoo just then, so I thought: why not go out and hear some music? After all, I don't know anyone here (new in town), and I'm hardly going to meet people in my own living room; what better use for my unexpected $5 than that?

Since I was new in town, I also didn't know where to go to hear music, so I basically picked somewhere at random from the local free alternative paper and just went. And who was playing?

A big hair metal band.

I hate big hair metal bands.

I was so, so, disappointed. I mean, this was the last $5 I was going to have available as far as the eye could see, and I had spent it on a big hair metal band.

Sigh.

Hilzoy, I marvel at the depth and variety of your experience.

I was so, so, disappointed. I mean, this was the last $5 I was going to have available as far as the eye could see, and I had spent it on a big hair metal band.

Too funny. I feel for you. (Sorry Lt. Nixon!)

Maybe it’s a conciliatory dog whistle to the Log Cabin People?

Somewhere, Mark Penn is crossing out another entry on his list of microtrends, a look of consternation clouding his face.

Hilzoy, I marvel at the depth and variety of your experience.

Admit it -- you're just afraid she'll bean you in the face with a newspaper.

"Shiny, shiny pants and bleach-blond hair
A double kick drum by the river in the summer"

"Shiny, shiny pants and bleach-blond hair
A double kick drum by the river in the summer"

WTF?

YHF!

I was so, so, disappointed. I mean, this was the last $5 I was going to have available as far as the eye could see, and I had spent it on a big hair metal band.

St. Paul civic center
Giving me a 8 dollar and 50 cent!
I bought a headache

Smoking marijuana and it’s comin’ out of my ears
A long haired girl shakin’ way past her years

Allright, thank you, everybody feel alright? everybody happy?

-- The Replacements!!!!!!!

+1L

"Shiny, shiny pants and bleach-blond hair
A double kick drum by the river in the summer"

Last Friday!

My favorite line about the Replacements:

"Sometimes the band would show up too drunk to play their own songs, and instead play covers, which they were also too drunk to play."

I'm actually still liking the Replacements these days, about fifteen years after first hearing them.

Never heard them play drunk, though, unless they recorded drunk.

Never heard them play drunk, though, unless they recorded drunk.

i'd bet big money that most of Hootenany (by which we sync up with the top of the thread) was recorded drunk. for sure the title track, Mr Whirley, ... and Lovelines:

    Hey Ellen Mark says hi Tom, what else can I say I love you very much I'm glad we're together Miss you a lot Love Kitten Ooh yeah ooh yeah Kitten Ooh yeah ooh yeah

the Replacements make me feel both young and old. i learned about them just as they were disintegrating, so i missed their peak: made me feel young. but they pretty much lost touch with the scene by the time i figured that out: so, old.

and now, they're dinosaurs. and i bet i couldn't find two people at work who has heard of them, and fewer who own one of their records.

i wear an onion on my belt - it was in style when i was a lad.

I'd be surprised if Bob Stinson wasn't drunk on a lot of their recorded output. I mean obviously on the early live stuff the whole band was trashed. And I had friends that would go to their shows in the early/mid 80s (I was in my "hardcore is the only music that matters" phase at that point, and they weren't hardcore, really, so I skipped...) and come back all ticked off that the band was too drunk to be able to even finish a single song, and they'd swear they were never going to another Replacements show, and then they'd go to the next one.

But Stinson died in 1995 at age 35, not of an overdose or anything, according to the coroner. Just from living the way he did for 20 or 25 years.

I think this one is my favorite, probably followed by the whole of "Let it Be". There's this 33 1/3 series of books about important rock albums, and of them, my favorite so far is Colin Meloy of the Decembrist's coming of age story about finding Let It Be. Good stuff.

I think this one is my favorite,

OMFG. all those 81 clips are awesome.
tnx for the link.

Bob looked 35, then.

YouTube lies... this has nothing do with Paul Westerberg.

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