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July 30, 2008

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Wow, that was really refreshing to read.

Good for the WaPo. But the damage to Obama is done all ready and the Rovean message is out in public. So, from the McCain camp point of view, they achieved what they wanted: a short, cheap run for the ad and endless, free media repeats of the ad as "News." We've seen it all before in Bush's 2000 & 2004 campaign. "And so it goes."

EL:
Probably, but McCain’s lie is out on the table too, now. And just maybe the MSM will run with it. Stranger things have happened, though agreed holding our collective breath is probably not a good idea.

McCain's advisers said they do not intend to back down from the charge, believing it an effective way to create a "narrative" about what they say is Obama's indifference toward the military.
Sooo slimy. Sooo typical.
So it goes, indeed. (My favoritist Vonnegut maxim.)

on the other hand, the WaPo is lying about Obama.

so, you know, it all evens out...

...

for McCain.

Maybe now that the Post put it out there so honestly, other media outlets can pick up on it. My guess is that we'll hear about it in the debates this fall.

Our local NPR station is having a chat with Paul Alexander, author of “Man of the People: The Maverick Life and Career of John McCain". I submitted the following, some part of which I hope makes it to air:

Please see the report from the Washington Post entitled "McCain Charge Against Obama Lacks Evidence", for the just one example of the mavericky (emphasis on the "icky" maverickness of Maverick McCain.

Please make sure that you cover:
* McCain's repeated inability to tell Shiite from Sunni
* His lack of understanding of "cap and trade"
* His echoing of Obama's positions (on US troops in Afghanistan, and now on timetables, for example)
* His continued voting against veteran benefits, and the poor record most veteran groups hold of him

McCain has received a complete white-wash from the press. It's time for NPR to start telling the truth about how McCain has repudiated every value that made him a "maverick".

crap.

my second link, above, should be this one.

To repeat for the thread a point made elsewhere, the Post wrote this story because this particular McCain lie implicates them as participants. The press cannot play "he said, she said" since they witnessed the events. McCain botched the slime move by requiring the press to vouch for it, which offends their little egos. They would happily repeat the false chatter as news if it did not also require them to put their own credibility on the line in airing the charge.

So its hard to give them THAT much credit.

and now McCain's team is saying "yeah, we were wrong, but it's the media's fault!!"

doesn't matter now. the mission was accomplished. the lie is out there.

Thank you, John McCain.

I've been feeling pessimistic about the state of affairs in this country lately.

The desperation oozing from your campaign as it resorts to using these sleazeball lies as the centerpiece of your run for President of the United States has cheered me up considerably.

Clearly you know something I don't. Thanks again. I feel much better now.

Oh yes, and I'll add my thanks also to the Washington Post for highlighting the good news.

The press cannot play "he said, she said" since they witnessed the events.

Really? How about Andrea Mitchell who was with Hillary during the infamous Bosnia visit? She was there, saw no sniper fire or special landing, and didn't make a sound.

From the Washington Post article:

“It is entirely likely that someone would have attacked us for having gone. And it is entirely likely -- and it has come about -- that people have attacked us for not going."

"That's completely untrue, and I think, honestly, they know it's untrue,"

Claiming victimhood and blaming ‘they’ is how Obama has earned his living to date. It is what he knows. In America-2008, it is a good strategy. But it still doesn’t explain why Obama chose to go to the gym. My gut tells me that he is afraid to look soldiers in the eye. My take is that his arrogance is rooted in insecurity.

This is why he will choose Kaine as VP.

So the trip was conducted solely for campaign purposes,duh, and they did or didn't visit because they would be criticized either way, so the reason Sen. Obama couldn't/wouldn't visit the troops was for perceived appearance concerns. What a mess. And they are whining because Sen. McCain's campaign took advantage of their perpetual confusion. And you think this is a plus - for Sen. Obama?? Or not!

But it still doesn’t explain why Obama chose to go to the gym.

Why did Obama go to the [military] gym in Afghanistan instead of the hospital in Germany? He failed to use the time machine to see how it would turn out!

Obama presents himself to photographers while wearing a United States Marine Corps tee-shirt. You are not supposed to do that. He was not a Marine. I don’t think he understands that.

But it still doesn’t explain why Obama chose to go to the gym. My gut tells me that he is afraid to look soldiers in the eye.

Um, in the clip from the McCain commercial where Obama is in the gym, he's there with US soldiers. They're the ones cheering him when he makes the three-pointer in the rest of the video.

BOB, it was given to him by, you know, MARINES! If he hadn't worn it you'd be complaining about the slap in the face over that. Come up with something better, please.

McCain wears a Navy hat. Obama is not supposed to wear that shirt, especially before the cameras, regardless of who gave it to him. If you do not understand this femdem, I will not be able to explain it to you.

Just an observation.

Our local NPR station is having a chat with Paul Alexander, author of “Man of the People: The Maverick Life and Career of John McCain".

It turned out that Paul Alexander was, indeed, more of a hagiographer thajn biographer. When one caller said that his biography was a "work of fiction", he could only reply, "Then don't vote for McCain"!

Sorry, BOB, I grew up an Air Force brat and I work for the Army now. Explain it to me please, 'cuz otherwise I'm just going to make assumptions about where you come up with ideas like that.

Having joined and then lurked in many threads after BOB has rendered them toxic to any further productivity, how about we don't, femdem?

I keep forgetting the comment rules here. One s-bomb is worse than 1000 reactionary, baiting assertions, right?

"my second link, above, should be this one."

You're accusing the political humor columnist of "lying"? About what, specifically?

BOB: "Claiming victimhood and blaming ‘they’ is how Obama has earned his living to date."

You're quite the liar.

"My gut tells me that he is afraid to look soldiers in the eye."

My gut tells me you enjoy lying. My take is that it is rooted in insecurity.

"Obama presents himself to photographers while wearing a United States Marine Corps tee-shirt. You are not supposed to do that."

According to... you.

"He was not a Marine. I don’t think he understands that."

I don't think you understand that millions of people wear tee-shirts and don't expect anyone to confuse them with their slogans, logos, or with a military uniform.

But, oh, noes, Obama's clever scheme to fool people into thinking he was a Marine may come to naught!

Wow, you think everyone but you is a moron, don't you? Sad how all those genetically defective people aren't up to your superior genetic heritage, and your male superiority.

"If you do not understand this femdem, I will not be able to explain it to you."

I believe you. White supremecists have trouble explaining lots of things.

Sorry; that should be "supremacists."

You are not supposed to do that.

Eh, what? A USMC teeshirt is uniform?

BTW: I've got a 1st SOG AC-130H teeshirt, but I'm not aircrew. Maybe I need to get rid of it?

To heck with the T, why didn't he just go visit the troops. Sheesh!!

You're accusing the political humor columnist of "lying"? About what, specifically?

about what he said.

    Inside, according to a witness, he told the House members, "This is the moment . . . that the world is waiting for," adding: "I have become a symbol of the possibility of America returning to our best traditions."

that's a bit of a nasty distortion of what Obama actually said.

"To heck with the T, why didn't he just go visit the troops."

He did. He spoke to them, shook hands with them, played basketball with them. He cancelled the hospital visit when it threatened to become controversial. Of course it has anyway, for no real reason at all--except that some people want to rag on the guy no matter what he does.

You’re safe Slartibartfast. Obama could walk around in a USAF fighter pilot suit and it would be acceptable too. The Air Force is different than the Marines. They don’t get too worked up about things. All the nice restaurants and movie theaters on their bases keep them happy and distracted.

Some services are very protective of their http://www.manlyweb.com/realmen/military/chestypuller.html ">Heritage and don’t like seeing it used as a political prop.

Obama should buy a flight suit instead of the USMC tee-shirt. That would be fine. I need to disclose that I was not a Marine, but I did train with them.

Sorry BOB, I know people in several branches, and you're allowed to wear the T-shirts. They're not uniforms, and it's not impersonation by any means. Which is why various military members buy them as gifts for friends, family, etc. If they give you a T-shirt, it's safe to assume you can wear it.

Honestly, there's no rule that civilians can't wear bits of uniform, either. Hence surplus stores, uniforms used in movies, and child-sized versions of many uniforms sold at military exchanges. Most of the actual rules are about when and where military members can or cannot wear the uniforms, not civilians.

Sorry BOB, I know people in several branches, and you're allowed to wear the T-shirts. They're not uniforms, and it's not impersonation by any means. Which is why various military members buy them as gifts for friends, family, etc. If they give you a T-shirt, it's safe to assume you can wear it.

Honestly, there's no rule that civilians can't wear bits of uniform, either. Hence surplus stores, uniforms used in movies, and child-sized versions of many uniforms sold at military exchanges. Most of the actual rules are about when and where military members can or cannot wear the uniforms, not civilians.

f'n-A.

if Obama did go visit the troops in the hospital, all the jerkoffs who are fainting about his non-visit now would be accusing him of doing a cynical photo-op (even though there wouldn't have been any cameras allowed); the usual idjits would be calling up wounded soldiers trying to dig up dirt on it; Hannity would be guffawing about how he had to make the visit on the sly because he didn't want anyone to see the chilly reception. etc. etc. etc.

this whole thing is a non-issue based on a blatant media-targeted BS story from a dishonorable serial liar who has teamed-up with the slimiest fncking reptile to work in politics since Nixon.


F John McCain. he's fallen from what i considered to be the last decent conservative to a lower-than usual GOP feces-flinger.

pardon my boldness.

"that's a bit of a nasty distortion of what Obama actually said."

Yes, I quite agree.

I guess I have a different definition of what a "lie," is, though.

"To heck with the T, why didn't he just go visit the troops."

Since you ask. Hope this helps.

Obama has, of course, visited troops without press many times.

[...] In the past, Mr. Obama has met privately with wounded veterans at Walter Reed Army Medical Center. U.S. Sen. Jack Reed, D-R.I., who accompanied Mr. Obama on part of his tour, said Mr. Obama met privately with troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Honestly, there's no rule that civilians can't wear bits of uniform, either.

There is no written rule, it is an understanding held among some. I have witnessed a very large Sergeant convey this understanding, in a very professional manner, to people wearing the garb who had long hair and earrings. The individuals receiving the understanding were very very polite to the very large Sergeant and stated that they fully understood the understanding.

The understanding that the Sergeant conveyed to the polite young studies was something along the lines of Senator Webb can wear a USMC tee shirt. This was not a rogue Sergeant. He taught 0630 traditions class to the others on Thursdays. Maybe things have changed but I kind of doubt it.

I’m simply trying to provide a service to Senator Obama by saying that he should hang up the tee shirt and dress like a fighter pilot. It may clear up future misunderstandings. Too bad ‘Maverick’ is already taken. Perhaps his call sign could be ‘Presto’ (Chango, get it?). It may very well earn him the vote of the very large Sergeant. Call me Foreign Policy Advisor #301.

BOB, when will you ever be able to admit you may be wrong about something. In this case you are definitely wrong.

There may be a more arrogant and at the same time clueless commenter on this site than you, but I haven't seen him/her yet.

BBM, give it up. You might keep trying to hang on to something that has no validity, but it would show a lot about yourself to concede that both McCain's and your arguements have no merit.

My gut tells me you enjoy lying. My take is that it is rooted in insecurity.

My gut tells me BOB enjoys winding us all up with his random brain droppings. I wouldn't exactly call them lies, the truth of them isn't the point.

They bubble up into Bill's stream of consciousness like butterflies, and he assumes they must be so. Then, he presents them to us and enjoys the attention when we all try to respond as if they were worthy of comment.

It is rooted in insecurity, though. He's afraid Obama is going to come in the night and steal his potatoes. Oh, and his harem, too.

It keeps him up at night. The dude can't get any rest.

he's fallen from what i considered to be the last decent conservative to a lower-than usual GOP feces-flinger.

The bar for lower-than-usual is pretty low, but I think he's headed in that direction.

Thanks -

My gut tells me BOB enjoys winding us all up with his random brain droppings. I wouldn't exactly call them lies, the truth of them isn't the point.

i dunno. i find that his enthusiasm for pie is contagious. i think i might just have to buy some apples tomorrow. he's given me the craving...

Hey, cleek, is there a version of that pie thingie that works with Safari?

We will agree to disagree on this but I am right. A USMC shirt signifies that either the wearer (or perhaps a family member of the wearer) has earned the respect due a Marine. It would be one thing for Obama to have worn the tee shirt in a closed session. It is another thing to put on the shirt and have a photo opportunity.

It is bad form.

The technical term for that, Russell, is bullshit.

Got you beat there http://brickoven.blogspot.com/2007/11/this-is-utter-bullshit.html ">Anarch.

Hahaha. He shouldn’t have worn the shirt.

I seem to remember Ronald Reagan returning the salutes of Marines on his way into the White House when he was President. BOB, since Reagan was not an officer in the USMC, should he have been doing that?

I realize he was CIC, but he was not an officer in the USMC.

Phil,

according to this, you can run GreaseMonkey scripts in Safari.

It is bad form.

You know, you have a minor point about the shirt.

It's easy to put a shirt on, but it's really hard to be a Marine. If you want to look at it that way, a non-Marine wearing a USMC shirt could be seen as kind of disrespectful, especially if it was worn as just kind of a fashion accessory.

Not everyone would see it that way, but it's not unreasonable for some folks to do so.

The thing is, apparently it was some Marines who gave him the shirt.

If it comes down to either a Marine, or you, saying that it's cool for Obama to wear the shirt, I'm gonna go with the Marine.

What my gut is really telling me here is that it's hard to the point of impossibility for you, Bill, to get your head around the idea that Obama has legitimately achieved what he has.

Because he's a black man.

Columbia. Harvard Law, and president of the law review. Couple of years of community organizing. Teaching ConLaw. Pretty successful career as a state legislator. Elected to Senator, and a pretty good legislative track record while a Senator. Successful in a very, very hard fought primary battle for Democratic nominee for President. Doing well against a pretty strong Republican opponent.

Holy freaking crap, the next President of the US might be a black man.

None of this can be due to his intelligence, drive, political skill, positive message, or plain old hard work.

He's a black man. It had to have been handed to him, somehow, by somebody.

Racism is like any other rigid ideology. It puts blinders on you. You can't accept the plain reality that's in front of your face, so you have to mangle the reality to fit your prejudice. You may even have to make stuff up to make the puzzle pieces fit.

It's a lot of work.

Save yourself some time and effort, dude. Obama's a smart, hard working, talented guy, with a positive and constructive message. He's a natural leader, and he's not taking crap off of anyone.

He may well be the next President, and if he is, it will be on the merits.

Get your head around it. Your life will be much easier. You'll save us all a lot of time, too.

Thanks -

Bravo, russell. It all may well have been a wasted effort, but bravo nonetheless.

I'm not a huge Obama fan, but he's definitely not dumb, and he's definitely capable. And, like you, I'm inclined to think that if a Marine gave him a USMC teeshirt, and Marines stood by mute while he wore it in public, that Obama's having worn it in public is just fine.

No one is dumb enough to imagine that Obama's wearing of that shirt is anything more than him honoring the USMC, are they? I'd tend to look at it like: they did him an honor by inviting him to wear it, and he couldn't hardly then refuse to do so, could he?

BOB has me agreeing with norbizness these days to an extent that I'm not very comfortable with. Possibly it's because he's that wrong, but it's still uncomfortable.

Folding up the T-Shirt discussion, as an Obama supporter, I do want to give him one piece of advice:

Don't get off a plane, waving to those assembled, TV cameras recording every move, chewing gum.

I've seen him do this a couple times, and, on the one hand, I can't believe this bothers me.

On the other hand, it just does not look Presidential.

BBB - That's probably nicotine gum he's chewing, so I'd cut him some slack. (Speaking as an ex-smoker who needed Chantix to finally break the habit, after the gum didn't work.)

The MSM is replaying the Brit/Paris ad over and over now as "News.". After some negative comment about the ad, the MSM is now saying that the message of an "empty suit" as represented in the Brit/Paris ad is sticking because Obama's trend line in the polls is down per the Quinniapac polls in Florida, Penn, and Ohio today. The MSM is also absolving McCain of blame for the slime: "It's those nasty people around him. Not Straight Talk John." And it's only just the gentle stuff for now. Karl Rove lives. Be. Very. Afraid.

Good point, CaseyL. Hadn't thought of that.

I am afraid, El:

It seems like for all of his mistakes, gripes and attacks on Obama the MSM hasn't held McCain accountable for the cheap campaign he is running.

I wish the debates were TOMORROW so the American public could see how stupid this "empty suit" talk is.

McCain is clearly taking a page out of the Karl Rove playbook -- going right after your opponent's strength; in this case, making Obama's popularity and ability to draw crowds seem like a bad thing. Mind-boggling. But they are so good at this attack thing, I wouldn't be surprised if it gains traction.

I think Obama needs to advance the ball further and get down to the meat-and-potatoes of the campaign -- focusing on the Economy over and over again, and joining McCain at Bush's hip over and over again. He hasn't done enough of this.

Finally, why wait any longer about naming his VP candidate?

Both campaigns seem to be off-message right now. Right now, the GOP is having its fun pairing Obama with Britney and Paris. Naming the VP choice -- it seems like Kaine or Biden -- would make that seem even dumber and more petty than it already is.

if Obama did go visit the troops in the hospital, all the jerkoffs who are fainting about his non-visit now would be accusing him of doing a cynical photo-op

like i said...

    What the McCain campaign doesn’t want people to know, according to one GOP strategist I spoke with over the weekend, is that they had an ad script ready to go if Obama had visited the wounded troops saying that Obama was...wait for it...using wounded troops as campaign props.

McCain is outBushing Bush.

From war hero to world-class asshole.

Pity.

"McCain is outBushing Bush."

It's never been about Bush; this is the leadership of the Republican Party, acting on behalf of their interests, and specifically on behalf of the interests of the people behind them. Who the figure up front is doesn't matter in this regard. It would be the same if it were Romney, or Huckabee, or whomever. Anyone who would throw these guys out wouldn't get the nomination.

This is actually rather important.

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