Make It Stop

by publius

I just turned on MSNBC this afternoon for rules committee updates and I feel like the pushback on the network is working (i.e., they seem overly self-conscious of sounding too pro-Obama). They're going out of their way to air Clinton's absurd scenarios, without actually noting the absurdities.

For instance, the big question has been "what's Clinton's scenario at this point?" And several pundits have said something like, "Well, she can say that she comes out of this weekend with victories in Puerto Rico, Florida [!], and Michigan [!]. Her popular vote superiority is now legitimized [!]. She comes out of this week with some new momentum..."

Momentum? After June 3? I'm sorry, but this is just absurd. I mean, it was bad enough when the press treated the outcome as still in doubt after Texas and Ohio, but now it looks like the whole "he said/she said" may continue after Tuesday's final primaries as well. What's more, the idea that the "popular vote" from Florida and Michigan is legitimized is equally absurd.

It's not being legitimized -- the DNC is essentially changing the rules to incorporate a flawed "election" to avoid a political embarrassment, largely because one candidate is holding the party in a hostage-like situation. I mean, the entire Michigan and Florida argument has been repeated so many times that it's easy to lose sight of the fundamental absurdity underlying the whole thing. Clinton herself said that they didn't really "count" back when she didn't need them. Obama didn't campaign there, and I'm sure many thousands didn't bother showing up.

All in all, it's not a promising start. And I'm really starting to fear that she actually will stick around through the convention, using today's "victories" as a rallying cry.

On a final note, I think that the Clinton campaign's tactics right now are designed to get her on the ticket. The leverage is the threat not to go quietly into that good night.

Comments

[OCSteve]

How much do you actually save buying popcorn in bulk?

[publius]

ha - i'll get back to you on that steve.

maybe i'm overreacting. i've never actually believed she would carry on to denver. but i honestly don't know now. i suspect they're on a "weeks" horizon rather than
'months', but that's still going to damage

[cleek]

you're not overreacting. she is going to continue to Denver. her supporters are going to go completely insane, and we're going to learn about a new class of voters: McCain Democrats.

[DJA]

McCain Democrats

Sweet Christmas, Cleek. But you're right, of course.

Publius, I don't know how anyone could look at what went on today, both inside and outside, and not come to the conclusion that Hillary is in it until Denver, and will use every tactic available to her to keep her supporters riled up till then.

[Daniel]

McCain Democrats

Yep. And if Hillary pulled this out of nowhere and somehow got the nomination I would be one of them. We can't afford more of this kind of president, and I honestly believe McCain would be better for the nation than Hillary.

[CharleyCarp]

Whoa, there, pilgrim: let me ask you if it's the war with Iran, the continuation of the Bush tax cuts, or packing the bench with Scalia types.

[Jamelle]

And let's hope that Senator Clinton isn't on the ticket and November. I can think of no surer way to reenergize the Republican base. They might dislike Bush and are disappointed with McCain, but they hate the Clintons, and will go the distance to prevent another Clinton from being a stones throw from the Oval Office.

[matttbastard]

McCain Democrats

Yep. And if Hillary pulled this out of nowhere and somehow got the nomination I would be one of them. We can't afford more of this kind of president, and I honestly believe McCain would be better for the nation than Hillary.

Imported from another thread:

Does anyone else read screeds like [Daniel's] and wonder how many people like that are actually democrats and how many are republican rat-fsckers? I mean, if that sort of thing was written by someone who had been commenting here for a year or two, I wouldn't question their authenticity, but when you see random newbies with such, um, extremely strong opinions that might be, um, lacking in factual support, I do wonder...

Posted by: Turbulence | May 31, 2008 at 05:10 PM

[Alan Trout]

“We can’t drive our SUVs and eat as much as we want and keep our homes on 72 degrees at all times ... and then just expect that other countries are going to say OK”
~ Barack Hussein Obama

PLEASE WATCH AND EMAIL THESE LINKS OUT NOW TO YOUR FAMILY, CO-WORKERS AND FRIENDS!!

Obama’s Pastor Celebrates 9/11 (explicit)Only 5 Days After 3,000 Americans Killed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzhl-endvco

Jeremiah Wright Says America Deserved 9/11
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9HUdF9OZa8

Obama’s Racially-Divisive Pastor
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUbUBTlmAiA

Obama Disrespecting U.S. Flag and Anthem
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8QCkgg5Kjo

The Audacity of Barack Hussein Obama
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwjnT4eJJvs

The Audacity of Barack Hussein Obama 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeC8BE-2T_k

Is Obama Wright? - Pastor Wright & Senator Obama
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72B3tUAqpo4

Obama’s Pastor - 9/11 Fault of Israel Association
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnI431s1r6s

Father Pfleger's Rant - Final Straw or Obama Exit Strategy?

Name Obama’s Accomplishments if you can #1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGeu_4Ekx-o

Name Obama’s Accomplishments if you can #2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzFOOcEQtP0

Barack Obama: There Will Be Bamboozling
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuB_W8o_UsU

The Two Things Senator Obama Accomplished
http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/02/27/obamas-empty-change-message/

The Jeremiah Wright Lifetime Achievement Award
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Prhnc2fxAzg

Gaza Strip Palestinians Campaigning for Obama
http://youtube.com/watch?v=21YF7ggCG6g

Barack Obama Doesn’t Want His Daughters ‘Punished’ With a Baby
http://youtube.com/watch?v=eNzmly28Bmg

Obama: Bitter Americans Cling to Guns and Religion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNJAl8a3d9Q

Obama — We Are Building A Religion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xtNr5-up0U

[Fledermaus]

i suspect they're on a "weeks" horizon rather than 'months', but that's still going to damage

I don't know that they'll do that much "damage" - like Bush it appears that the Clintons are uniters not dividers.

[Mike McHugh]

1) Breathe deeply
2) Contemplate Iraq war, restoring balance to the three branches of government, supreme court nominations
3) Steel self for whatever democratic ticket emerges
4) Bang head on wall until unconscious
5) Wake up and repeat

[Bruce Baugh]

That's about it, Mike, yes.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

MSBC should be worried about sounding too pro-Obama.

Keith Olbermann kisses his ass on a nightly basis.

Chris Mathews gets a woddie every time Obama gives a speech.

David Gregory and Dan Abrams are their only high-profile anchors -- anchors, mind you -- who act in a fairly objective.

Keith Olberman?

He can kiss my white, boney ass.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

That was meant to read -- "fairly objective manner."

Writing in a hurry because I am late too work.

If Olbermann waits until 6 pm, he can kiss my boney -- sweaty -- white ass.

He is no better than Bill O'Reilly. In fact, he is worse.

Yes, I said worse.

Have at.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

Man, I am late.

And mad:

Make that: HAVE AT IT.

The Democrats, just from the very sound of this post and the whining about MSNBC, are already sounding like the whiny, latte-drinking, Volvo-drinking crowd that the Republicans successfully painted us as when they won Kerry v. Bush.

For the record, I drive a 1992 Ford F-150, the wife drives a Hyundai Azera, wouldn't know what a latte is if you shoved it right in front of my nose -- drink Coke, Tea, A & W Root beer, and Yengling. MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

Oh yes, as I had off to work -- with my wife yelling at me that I am late -- let me be clear:

I have nothing against Volvo drivers.

Nothing against latte drinkers.

Cheers.

[Turbulence]

The Democrats, just from the very sound of this post and the whining about MSNBC, are already sounding like the whiny, latte-drinking, Volvo-drinking crowd that the Republicans successfully painted us as when they won Kerry v. Bush.

So, would it be fair to say that you're concerned about how the Democrats sound?

Are you aware that this website has far less influence on the world than MSNBC?

For the record, I drive a 1992 Ford F-150, the wife drives a Hyundai Azera, wouldn't know what a latte is if you shoved it right in front of my nose -- drink Coke, Tea, A & W Root beer, and Yengling.

Um, why should anyone at all care? Your choice in vehicles and beverages doesn't seem to have given you particularly good insight into the political process. Given how closely voting for Bush and supporting the war correlate with driving an F-150 and hating Starbucks, one might argue that people who drive F-150s and hate Starbucks both have really bad judgment and are hurting America. But I think more sensible people realize that this crap has nothing to do with anything important.

bedtimeforbonzo, it is fitting that you would support Clinton to the end. Like the Tuzla Tigress, you haven't bothered to read vital intelligence documents before demanding more conflict. That worked out real well for Clinton and I'm sure it will work out equally well for you.

By the way, did you start commenting on the internet before Clinton's campaign? Can you point us to any comments anywhere before 2008 that would suggest you're a real Democrat and not a right wing rat-fscker?

Make that: HAVE AT IT.

Why should we? Are you deliberately trying to provoke argument? Is that what you get paid for?

[Gary Farber]

"He can kiss my white, boney ass."

Could you consider, perhaps, upping the ratio of your comments which are on factual topics, with cites to facts, and which lead to productive conversation, and dropping the number of your comments which are fact-free exclamations, which appear to be directed at no one but yourself? If you feel a need to vent, perhaps try a wall; if you're not interested in fact-based conversation, it will do as well. As it is, your comments seem to largely be substance-free emotional discharges, which leave no ground for rational discussion, and which otherwise serve only to provide fodder for equally substance-free responses.

Thanks for your consideration, and help in keeping ObWi a place for substantive and courteous discussion.

[Gary Farber]

"Man, I am late.

And mad"

That's nice.

I have emotions, too. So do all of us.

Emotions can't be rationally debated. What is your goal in going on on this blog about your emotions? This isn't a therapy session, you know. If you need a place to talk about how you feel, rather than matters of substance which can be settled as matters of fact, perhaps consider finding an appropriate place for that sort of thing. A group therapy session, a friend, a spouse, a mirror, a therapist, a tree, whatever. Thanks kindly for your help in not encouraging other people here to go on about their emotional state.

Really, do you care what I feel about, well, much of anything? Why should you be interested? Answer: you shouldn't, unless we establish a personal relationship. In which case, we should take our discussion of our feelings to email, or at the least, to an open thread.

Meanwhile, I'm not clear what the answer is that you have in mind to "why should we care how you feel [about some political issue or event]?," but the answer at least a couple of your interlocuters would provide is "beats me."

[dr ngo]

It's Yuengling.

[Anarch]

And it's delicious.